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Randy Johnson announces retirement

Bob Nightengale of USA Today, reports via Twitter, that it appears that Randy Johnson will announce his retirement.  He's holding a press conference tomorrow a conference call this evening with the media to discuss his future. [Update by Jim. Looks like Johnson changed the date, to avoid clashing with the Hall of Fame announcements scheduled for tomorrow]

Johnson will finish with five Cy Young awards, 303 wins, 4,875 strikeouts, and a 3.29 ERA in 4,135.3 career innings.  Baseball-Reference puts his career earnings at $175.55MM. I think it's easy to say that Johnson is a first ballot hall-of-famer, and probably the first to go in the hall as a D-back. I'm sure there should be more to follow.

Hat tip to MLBTradeRumors for the scoop.

[Update] This indeed proved to be the case, with Johnson ending his career, having reached the mark of 300 wins last season with San Francisco. No real shocks or surprises in his statements, and it seems definitive: he said, "It's taken this long into January because I definitely wanted to just kind of relax from the season being over and make sure I had a clear head when I made this decision, and that I would be making it wholeheartedly and would be sticking to it."

With regard to the cap issue, Johnson politely deflected the inquiry, saying: "That's a good question. I played for a lot of teams and a lot of teams I feel I made my mark with, but that's really a decision that's out of my control. I believe it's something that's decided for you. I'm not even 24 hours into my retirement yet so I will wait down the road and consult with whoever I have to consult with if I'm elected to the Hall of Fame." However, it would be hard to argue his best years were with Arizona (ERA+ 164) and not Seattle (ERA+ 128), even if there were a couple more with the Mariners.

There'll be more on Randy's career with the Diamondbacks shortly.

Poll
The D-backs should retire Johnson's number...
Now
119 votes
When he goes into Cooperstown
34 votes
Only if he goes into Cooperstown as a Diamondback
49 votes
Not at all
10 votes

212 votes | Poll has closed

0 recs  |  Comment 69 comments |

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Comments

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And so begins the debate.

Will he go in as a Diamondback? I certainly hope so, but you can make a case for Seattle as well (more time, even though the best stretch of his career was certainly here).

The scariest thing about the Big Unit is how good his numbers might have been if he’d been at his Arizona level earlier in his career (say, before 28). I mean, you toss in another four, five years at his peak and we might be talking about one of the top three pitchers of all-time. As it is, top 10 certainly seems fitting.

by Azreous on Jan 5, 2010 5:22 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Well

he had effectively 10 seasons with the Mariners, compared with 8 on the Diamondbacks. 1 Cy Young in Seattle, 4 in Arizona. 5 All-Star Games with Seattle, 5 with the Diamondbacks. 130 wins with the Mariners, 118 with the Diamondbacks.

Went to the playoffs twice with the Mariners, three times with the Diamondbacks, including a World Series win and MVP trophy. 2162 strikeouts with Seattle, 2077 with Arizona. Career highs in wins and strikeouts a season both came at Arizona, and 4 of his 5 300+ strikeout years were with the Diamondbacks.

The Mariners only have the edge in time served, but it’s not even that big of a gap.

An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.

by soco on Jan 5, 2010 5:34 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

This is going to be a measure. . .

of how much class the current D’Back organization has. If they don’t appropriately honor him, perhaps by retiring his number, the FO would be effectively saying “we don’t care about the past or our organizational heritage.” On the other hand, if they do without regard to his service to other organizations, but focus on the extraordinary contributions he made to this club and this community, it would say a lot of positive things.

by NASCARbernet on Jan 5, 2010 7:26 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Heck,

they honored him LAST SEASON while he was playing for a division rival.

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 5, 2010 9:49 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I suppose

the second debate is naturally:

Should Randy Johnson be the first Diamondback to have his number retired? Do we even support the idea of retiring numbers?

An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.

by soco on Jan 5, 2010 5:36 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

8 years is not enough time for number retirement.

I reserve that unique honor for players who spent most of their career as dominate players with one team (Cal Ripken, Tony Gwynn, Derek Jeter) no matter how great 6 of the 8 years were.

by older fart on Jan 5, 2010 5:56 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Some retired numbers, 8 years or less w/ one team

Angels – Nolan Ryan (8)
Padres – Dave Winfield (8)
Cardinals – Dizzy Dean (7)
Yankees – Roger Maris (7), Reggie Jackson (5)
Orioles – Frank Robinson (6)
Rangers – Nolan Ryan (5)

These seem pretty reasonable to me. Here’s some winceworthy ones:

Padres – Randy Jones (8), Steve Garvey (5)
Rays – Wade Boggs (2)

In terms of retiring numbers, I agree 6-8 yrs with one club is historically short, but there is precedent for it, and judging from the first list above, I’d argue it’s some pretty good precedent.

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 5, 2010 7:29 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Plus, he only had 9 years with Seattle

And not really 9 years, mainly only 8 plus a September. The timing is comparable, and he won many more accolades with Arizona. 5 All Star games each, 4 Cy Youngs with AZ vs 1 Cy Young with SEA.

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 7:35 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Psssst

I just covered that ;-)

An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.

by soco on Jan 5, 2010 7:50 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yeah yeah yeah

I was just supporting Hacks! Gotta do it when I can. ;)

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 8:09 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I take it, then,

you dont concur this was The Decade that the illusion of American exceptionalism finally died ;-)

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 5, 2010 8:19 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I think I missed that conversation ;)

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 8:25 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Lucky You!!!

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 5, 2010 8:31 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I’m of the opinion that retiring numbers is currently overdone. How long before the Yankees are fielding teams all wearing triple digits?

My opinions aside, I’m sure the D’Backs and Mariners will both retire his number, if just for the temporary marketing buzz.

by older fart on Jan 6, 2010 11:09 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Aren’t you just sunshine and butterflies :).

"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8

by njjohn on Jan 6, 2010 2:09 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Good thing

we’re not the Yankees. I think the Red Sox have it right: only can have your number retired if you go to the Hall of Fame as a Sox, and have to have significant time with the Sox (10 years). Randy might not have 10 years with the Diamondbacks, but his time in our early years was some of the most important for the franchise.

An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.

by soco on Jan 6, 2010 8:13 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Wade Boggs for the Rays
:::snicker:::

"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8

by njjohn on Jan 6, 2010 2:08 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

But

Imagine for a second that we were slow to retire his number and some Joe Blow works his way up the ranks, and just like every basketball playing kid wants to wear 23 for Jordan, requests 51 because Johnson was his hero…. and then is a complete bust. That would taint the Big Unit’s number. Its just…. a cardinal sin to even allow that to be a possibility. I cannot allow that.

My imagination is greater than your nay-say.

by Jargamus Prime on Jan 7, 2010 11:37 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

What if

the player’s tenure was roughly 75% of the team’s existance?

by Counsellmember on Jan 5, 2010 7:31 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Exactly.

This isn’t a normal situation in regards to either the player or the organization. In my opinion, you retire the number in the first week of the season (I understand not doing it on the home opener in the interest of filling some more seats).

by Azreous on Jan 5, 2010 8:01 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Organizations

that factor their own lack of tenure (or long term success) into this type of decision, do so at their peril. Look at the Padres and Rays, above. In an effort to create buzz, they lowered generally accepted standards (of retiring numbers) – and now look kinda silly.

Barring steroid complications, I dont think we’ll have that problem honoring Johnson. His 51 gets retired on its own terms, well within the context of baseball history (see above).

No special dispensation required :-)

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 5, 2010 8:16 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Try to repeat that statement in 50 years.

/From my soap box and not taking a shot at Counsellmember specifically but the younger generation in general:

Please, please, please think with a broader perspective than the pop media. The good ole USofA will be a better place for it.

/End of Rant

by older fart on Jan 6, 2010 11:15 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I’m confused by this comment… please ’splain…

"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8

by njjohn on Jan 6, 2010 2:10 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Perspective mine

This is the way I see it, Fart.

Randy Johnson was the key player in the infant years of this franchise. He took us to the World Series on his back and essentially made Dbacks lifer fans during his time here (myself being one of them). He was the one that put AZ on the baseball map.

He is one of the best pitchers of all time, and his number deserves to be retired somewhere. Why not Arizona, where his team and own career were impacted the most?

No offense taken and none intended, but your “good ole” perspective is becoming outdated with the current state of baseball. You say number retirement should be reserved for players that spend most of their career with one team; that just isn’t the reality anymore. In fact, 8 years is probably well above the average tour a player takes with any team in his career.

Modern baseball, for better or worse, cannot be compared to the good old days. For clubs and players the stakes are too high for it to be anything but business. Thankfully, for most fans, it is still a pursuit of happiness…

…at least, that’s what MTV and MAXIM tell me ;)

by Counsellmember on Jan 6, 2010 7:19 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

If he

were retiring in 50 years then you might have a point.

An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.

by soco on Jan 6, 2010 8:16 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Besides

If his tenure was roughly 75% of the team’s existence in 50 years, I’d say we’d pretty much have to retire the number of a guy who played for the Diamondbacks for 45 years.

"I can just see it: Post 'Intervention? Why would I need an intervention?' And then he'd +1 himself."

by kishi on Jan 6, 2010 8:25 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Young team,

the guy’s going to the HoF, possibly in purple and teal, I don’t see any problem in retiring his #.

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 5, 2010 9:45 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

If he goes into the HoF as a Diamondbacks

I’d be down with this.

"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil

by Jim McLennan on Jan 5, 2010 6:30 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

And a poll has duly been created

To this end.

"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil

by Jim McLennan on Jan 5, 2010 6:33 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Where’s the “RJ’s jersey should be retired along with Travis Lee’s” option?

"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8

by njjohn on Jan 6, 2010 2:13 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

One career homerun

With Arizona seals it for me. It has to be with the D-Backs.

Wear your own fur.

by Sprankton on Jan 5, 2010 6:47 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Steve Gilbert is live-tweeting from it

Nothing big yet, but, just that he’s definitely retiring.

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 7:11 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Hmmm, he sidestepped the question on which cap he wants

IMHO, it HAS to be Dbacks…

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 7:17 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

If he really felt strongly about it,

which I don’t think he does, but if he did, I could see him going in as a Mariner.

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 5, 2010 9:56 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Turns out the press conference

was on ESPN News this whole time. Drat.

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 7:42 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Alas.

Would that I had the ability to change the headline to “Randy Johnson announces retirement.”

by Azreous on Jan 5, 2010 8:46 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Oh rly??

Like that? ;)

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 8:51 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Plus, I think there should be

an actual, “promoted-beyond-your-community” story with stats and stuff eventually. (Not that I’m volunteering, cuz I’m not, yet…)

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 8:53 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I'm already putting together one

for the front page of the Daily Sun, so I’m out. Too busy tonight to do it twice.

by Azreous on Jan 5, 2010 9:22 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Or you could post it here, right? :)

“Reprinted with permission of the Daily Sun, All Rights Reserved”

Things ’Skins has in common with foulpole for 400, please. -- soco

by snakecharmer on Jan 5, 2010 9:23 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I'll write it up tomorrow

Including a list of his ten greatest appearances.

"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil

by Jim McLennan on Jan 5, 2010 9:38 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

SBNation

already has a story up? With updates.

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 5, 2010 9:47 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Retire His Number

No other player was a bigger factor in the transition from ‘expansion’ to ‘respectable’ team than RJ. He is one of the biggest parts of the team’s history, given that the team has a (very) short history.
Oh, yeah, there was that one year…when the team won…everything. I seem to recall that he kinda, sorta had a roll in that.

Key to the game: Score More

by pygalgia on Jan 5, 2010 8:56 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

+100

Hard to put it much better than this.

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 5, 2010 9:48 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Well, “roll” could be spelled correctly ;). Or maybe RJ is a great baker.

"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8

by njjohn on Jan 6, 2010 2:12 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Agreed

And tally added to the poll. I can’t think of a better way to start the new season.

Wear your own fur.

by Sprankton on Jan 6, 2010 5:20 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I think it's a matter of class

was he one of the most instrumental pitchers in D’backs history?

Yes

did he help put the franchise on the map competitively?

Yes

Did he win major awards with the team?

Yes

Did he put butts in seats?

Yes

Then retire his number and say thank you for what he’s done. Yeah he got paid, but this is about building a history and a legacy, is there any really compelling reason not to? No caveats, no conditions, simply do the right thing.

I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....

by piratedan7 on Jan 5, 2010 9:17 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

is there any really compelling reason not to?

No.

 Is there any modern player (say, post WWII), who put together half a dozen years with a club, like RJ did for Arizona, whose number isnt retired by that club? Could be, but I cant think of any.

And there are all sorts of retired numbers of guys who played a little longer for teams who didnt approach RJ’s impact. Johnson’s like Reggie or Frank Robinson. A first rung HOFer, who burst like a supernova with a new team for a relatively brief period.

To me, it would seem odd ( if not unprecedented) for the Dbacks not to retire 51.

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 5, 2010 10:27 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

To me, it would seem odd ( if not unprecedented) for the Dbacks not to retire 51.

Agreed, and since their threshold has publicly been identified as, “when that player enters the HoF”, I don’t see how they could not retire 51.

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 5, 2010 10:42 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

It's probably sensible

to wait that long, in the event any ugly non-baseball considerations crop up, but I’ll be mildly surprised if they dont retire his number before then. The current FO may not like Randy much, but they could certainly benefit from the publicity.

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 6, 2010 1:48 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

The current FO may not like Randy much

They clearly liked him enough to a) bring him back to Arizona from NY, b) honor him on his return to Chase, even though he was playing for the opposing team, and c) agree to employ him after his retirement. As far as I know, the only evidence for this claim is their refusal to re-sign him for 2009 at his desired salary – a decision which proved absolutely right, purely in baseball terms. Was there something I missed?

"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil

by Jim McLennan on Jan 6, 2010 10:47 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Yes

A, B and C were business choices that imply little about friendship or personal relationships, beyond a minimum business compatability ( a,c) and a minimum public cordiality (b).

Your link is a good example. Here’s a guy who says he loves teaching the game, wants to coach, lives in the valley and has a personal services contract with the Diamondbacks. Yet I think most can read the polite quotes and surmise neither side is particularly eager to make that happen. It begs the question why, much the way it took Gonzo almost a year of “negotiating” to finally perform what looks to be some very uncomfortable front office work for these guys.

I also disagree, in several respects, with the reasoning that just because Randy didnt pitch well for the Giants that somehow this “proves” the Dbacks’ $2M-2.5M lowball was entirely a baseball decision. For one thing, it’s suspect to strictly exchange SF “numbers” into what RJ “would have” or “might have” done in Arizona, as AZ afforded better weather and less travel than SF – potentially huge considerations in projecting a 46 year old athlete’s performance. Second, as much as I respect JB’s pitching evaluations (and I do), I doubt he projected RJ at a 5.30+ park adjusted ERA for us, coming off that fine 2008 season. And even if he did, fangraphs values Randy’s awful 2009 pitching at $1.9M, barely less than what the Dbacks actually offered. That either shows how grossly they undervalued his 300th win and finishing his HOF career in Arizona, and/or suggests something else figured into their equation.

The truth is, Mr Kendrick felt screwed by Randy Johnson. Screwed by all the deferred salary that gave Jerry Colangelo glory and Kendrick the bill. Screwed by the 2007 injury. Mr Kendrick was determined never to be ‘screwed’ by Randy Johnson again, and felt (deeply, as Ken always does) that Johnson owed him his pitching services in 2009 for basically nothing.

Randy appeared very willing to pitch here for roughly half his market value (possibly even less, but we’ll never know). The Diamondbacks felt he owed it to the organization to pitch here for a net of less than one quarter of his market value. That mindset, that Johnson essentially owed the club backpay, governed Arizona’s 2009 “offer” and fuels much of the friction between the parties.

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 6, 2010 4:12 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Do you think RJ would be a good MLB coach, Diamond? I doubt it. Strikes me as a Larry Bird type. He might be a decent exec (if he has the head on his shoulders for that… I have no idea whether or not that is the case), but I have a hard time picturing him as a successful coach. I’d pick out several former DBacks as better coaching candidates than RJ (Counsell, Bell, Womack, Gonzo, Gracie) before I’d even consider RJ.

In terms of the team’s offer to RJ, where do you get the $2-2.5M #? In my mind I look at the number he got ($8M with $5M in incentives) as the real number we were against. Would he have come back to the DBacks for $8-10M (at a discount)? I’m sure. Was he worth that money? Better than his replacement Garland? Not even close.

And what makes you think Kendrick felt screwed by RJ? The deferred salary wasn’t his fault — he was actually being magnanimous in accepting a deferred salary (however ill conceived the idea was).

"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8

by njjohn on Jan 6, 2010 4:35 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

For one thing, it’s suspect to strictly exchange SF "numbers" into what RJ "would have" or "might have" done in Arizona,

It’s a lot more suspect to project that Johnson would somehow have justified an $8m price-tag. His 2009 performance – the actual one, not some mythical dream – failed even to justify our “lowball” offer. That’s the reality of a 46-year old pitcher who’s had three back surgeries. It’s a huge risk. If Randy got his nose bent out of joint by that, I imagine his 2009 performance must have been a reality check and a half.

Maybe some teams can be sentimental and pay three or four times actual value to give a pitcher a warm, squishy feeling. We can’t. S’funny how bringing RJ here is one of those “business choices that imply little about friendship or personal relationships” – but letting him go then supposedly proves Ken Kendrick hates him.

The truth is, Mr Kendrick felt screwed by Randy Johnson. Screwed by all the deferred salary that gave Jerry Colangelo glory and Kendrick the bill. Screwed by the 2007 injury. Mr Kendrick was determined never to be ‘screwed’ by Randy Johnson again, and felt (deeply, as Ken always does) that Johnson owed him his pitching services in 2009 for basically nothing.

Please provide sources to back these startling claims. If you can’t, then… Well, you know what we’ll have to think.

"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil

by Jim McLennan on Jan 6, 2010 6:36 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

It’s a lot more suspect to project that Johnson would somehow have justified an $8m price-tag.

That’s not the issue or price in question. It’s not particularly eye opening or suspicious that Arizona didnt beat out all the competition and sign Johnson. What’s eye opening and suspicious is that they offered him half of what any other baseball team would’ve offered him, if he had any interest in playing for them !. Before Randy categorically nixed a return to the East Coast, sources claimed the Red Sox and Phillies were prepared to offer him $10-12M.

I think it’s reasonable to assert the Dbacks didnt think RJ was worth $8-$12M because of injury risk, and therefore didnt sign him, but your assumption the FO somehow ‘nailed’ Johnon’s valuation at $1-$2M is utter hindsight. The fact is no baseball analysts had him valued near that low, and in retrospect, the Diamondbacks simply got lucky. Just like they got unlucky with Eric Byrnes, or when Randy went down in 2007. It happens all the time.

Maybe some teams can be sentimental and pay three or four times actual value to give a pitcher a warm, squishy feeling. We can’t.

C’mon, this is results oriented misdirection, Jim. Sure, the Giants (and others) offered alot more more than his “actual” value…value after the fact. But they paid in line with his projected value, which is what’s germane. Right or wrong, it was the Diamondbacks, not the Giants et al, who were notably divorced from the generally accepted range of RJ’s sabermetric valuations.

S’funny how bringing RJ here is one of those "business choices that imply little about friendship or personal relationships" – but letting him go then supposedly proves Ken Kendrick hates him.

I dont think it’s funny, curious or the least bit contradictory. We can go thru them one by one if you like, but the business rationale (ie “the price” given the circumstances and alternatives) in each of your instances seems fairly straightforward, whereas the stated rationale behind the 2.5M (ie Moorad insisting it was “a fair offer”) engendered all sorts of skepticism among respected analysts cognizant of Dbacks financial constraints.

Please provide sources to back these startling claims

It’s really weird. The only FO links I could find all said they “think the world” of Randy. I trust you appreciate the reference :-)

cheers

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 6, 2010 10:59 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Right or wrong, it was the Diamondbacks, not the Giants et al, who were notably divorced from the generally accepted range of RJ’s sabermetric valuations.

Just because you find someone willing to overpay for your car, doesn’t mean it’s a Ferrari. Randy Johnson in 2009 was worth almost exactly with what AZ offered for 2009. RJ’s “projected value” means absolutely nothing, because now we know his real value. It was the Diamondbacks, not the Giants et al, who got it right.

It’s really weird. The only FO links I could find all said they "think the world" of Randy.

Yeah, really weird. No evidence at all to support you. What are the odds of that?

"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil

by Jim McLennan on Jan 6, 2010 11:59 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

There, there

your beloved Diamondbacks are one big happy family ;-)

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 7, 2010 10:37 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

+1

I think we’re basically saying the same thing. Beyond being a great player, RJ is a historic player for the D’Backs.

Key to the game: Score More

by pygalgia on Jan 6, 2010 12:19 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Added

according to ESPN, Johnson has a one year agreement to work with the Diamondbacks in a “community” role.

Key to the game: Score More

by pygalgia on Jan 6, 2010 12:43 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

Excellent.

On any number of levels.

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 6, 2010 6:09 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

oh and not to mention

he did throw that perfect game for us.

by blank_38 on Jan 6, 2010 7:21 PM EST reply actions   0 recs

Stats aside...

I’d just like to reiterate a point that was made earlier: The Big Unit’s time made Diamonback baseball in Arizona viable.

The Mariners became a franchise in late seventies and were already an established team prior to Johnson’s arrival.

Prior to Diamondbacks, the state of Arizona had plenty of teams to root for. The valley of the sun was the leading migratory spot for snow birds and families all fleeing the midwest/east coast in search of better weather and new opportunities… and they brought their passion for baseball/allegences with them. That, coupled with the fact that there were already half a dozen teams here for spring training. Native Zonies across several generations didn’t have anything to call their own.

The Diamondbacks were in their second year when the Unit arrived and with the team squarely on his shoulders, won the NL West. We all know how the rest of history plays out. Johnson made baseball work here in the valley.

Baseball is a game a stats. Stats are what get you into Cooperstown and although I’d die a little if Johnson went in as a Mariner, the case can be made for it…. However, to tie my entire ramble together, induction into the Hall of Fame should also draw on what the Inductee meant to a city/state and a franchise… which Johnson does to the state of Arizona and your Arizona Diamondbacks.

My imagination is greater than your nay-say.

by Jargamus Prime on Jan 7, 2010 11:30 AM EST reply actions   0 recs

The only case

that can be made for Johnson as a Mariner is the slightly longer time he had with them, which comes out to be about a season. Every significant milestone and achievement besides 300 wins came with the Diamondbacks.

An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.

by soco on Jan 7, 2010 11:56 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I’m really not worried about this one. The HOF committee will do the right thing. It’ll be the ’Backs.

"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8

by njjohn on Jan 7, 2010 4:59 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

I see three choices here

DBacks
Mariners
Neither

The cap in Catfish Hunter’s plaque doesnt have a logo, cuz Catfish didnt want to choose between Oakland and the Yanks. I could see something like that happening here. We shouldn’t discount what Randy did in Seattle. I’m not saying the portfolio matches what he did here, but what he did in the 1995 ALDS was really big up there.

I went to a May game at Safeco, two three weeks before he got 300, and the place went nuts after a Randy video montage. I mean, really nuts. It surprised me. He’s popular there. Perhaps not their most popular ever, but the M’s havent retired any numbers either. Randy could be the first for them too.

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 8, 2010 7:09 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

....haven't retired any numbers

besides #42, of course.

I’m sure the M’s will retire his # when he goes into the HoF, even if he goes in as a Dback.

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 8, 2010 7:27 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

Hopefully

Ichiro will be retired by then…he’s wearing “Randy’s” old 51 as we speak.

If the FO is the focus of anything, something is seriously wrong with the picture ! - unnamedDBacksfan 2/20/09

by Diamondhacks on Jan 9, 2010 5:37 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

...Ichiro is 51??

….oops

"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"

by DbacksSkins on Jan 9, 2010 9:22 AM EST up reply actions   0 recs

well u gotta figure

that they are likely to retire Edgar Martinez’s and Ken Griffey Jr’s numbers before too long

I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....

by piratedan7 on Jan 9, 2010 1:36 PM EST up reply actions   0 recs

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