Edwin Jackson and/or Adam Kennedy to Arizona?
by Jim McLennan on Dec 7, 2009 6:41 PM EST
in News
126 comments
FoxSports.com reports, "The Tigers are close to trading right-hander Edwin Jackson, according to major-league sources. The identity of the team is not known, but both the Diamondbacks and Mariners are known to have interest. The discussions have been more serious with Arizona than Seattle, according to one source."
The same story also goes on to say, "The Mets and Diamondbacks are the teams showing the most interest in free agent Adam Kennedy, major-league sources say, viewing him as a potential starter at second base." However, Nick Piecoro poo-poohs the latter report: "We’re told this isn’t true. A year ago this time, Kennedy would have made sense. Not now. They’ve got too many holes with too little money to be worrying about second base." Piecoro also reported earlier today that Arizona were "not close" to acquiring Jackson.
The official line from Josh Byrnes is that Arizona is "spending time in trade discussions with various clubs at this time," but Byrnes wouldn't go into any specifics such as players.
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i was reading the big league stew’s winter meetings tracker and it said that the rumor is detroit’s asking price for edwin jackson is really high…..who could we possibly be trading to get jackson?
by mfan2010 on Dec 7, 2009 7:50 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Well
When I think “really high” then Eric Byrnes is the first nam- oh, wait, I see what you meant.
(Seriously, while Lincecum does look like a stoner, I’d say he’s a distant second to Byrnes.)
"Spam headline: 'YOU ARE CHOSEN!' Oh, Morpheus, you're getting pretty lazy."
"Or they are informing you you are Jewish in a very lame conversion campaign."
"In either case, sending me spam is not the way to invite me to Zion."
by kishi on Dec 7, 2009 8:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Jackson perhaps?
Bring back the Baltimore Chop!
by dima1109 on Dec 7, 2009 11:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I've also heard that the dbacks are in on Nick Johnson.
"When fascism comes to this country, it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross" - Upton Sinclair
by Zephon on Dec 7, 2009 8:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Doubtful
Too expensive, wants multi-years. We’d have to be marvelous morons to do that with Allen being at least close to ready.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 12:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well
If the $6-7M number is true, and multi year means two years, it would be a good deal :)
by paqs on Dec 8, 2009 2:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Multi year
Is 3-4. With Nick Johnson? That earns a “meh” from me.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 2:35 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He's not getting 4
3, maybe.
Come on, even Sabean isn’t crazy enough to give him 4.
Oh, wait :)
by paqs on Dec 8, 2009 2:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Precisely my point
Someone will be stupid. Someone always is. :)
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 3:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Also
does anyone know how much we would be expected to pay jackson if we were to get him?
by mfan2010 on Dec 7, 2009 8:20 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Arizona could really benefit from getting JAckson
That would give them one of the best rotations with Haren, Jackson, Webb, and Scherzer. And with Jackson moving to the NL he should be even better.
Check out my website, it has scouting reports for all the Orioles' top prospects and is updated daily. www.oriolesprospects.com
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by ravensfan3 on Dec 7, 2009 10:09 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
i think it could be good...
but the rumor seems to be that detroit would want a scherzer swap, and it doesn’t seem to really make sense for us to give up scherzer for jackson….we would still need a pitcher, and frankly, i think scherzer has more upside than jackson does…
by mfan2010 on Dec 7, 2009 10:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That would make zero sense for us. I’m not familiar with Detroit’s needs. They need a catcher and just lost Polanco, so maybe a 2B. Maybe Roberts, Snyder, and a high upside prospect— say Parra? I dunno.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
by njjohn on Dec 7, 2009 10:36 PM EST via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
How about this?
I’ve heard that the Tigers want young pitching for Jackson. We give them Snyder for a starting catcher upgrade, Roberts for a bench bat (almost strictly because we just don’t need him anymore and he’s a cheap option for DET, which would be appealing), and two of our three best lower-level minor-league pitchers not named Jarrod Parker (no sense to deal a guy whose value just took a dagger, especially when he still retains his ace upside) Mike Belfiore, Trevor Harden, and Wes Roemer (IMO). Or, if they would rather have a higher-level arm, one of the aforementioned and one of Billy Buckner, Daniel Schlereth, and Bryan Augenstein (the only one I would be hesitant to offer is Buckner). They get young arms, some positional upgrades, and some savings, we get Jackson.
Why it might work – Edwin Jackson really is that good, and if we can successfully unload Snyder’s salary in acquiring a starting pitcher, that would free up more money for another bullpen arm/infield bat. The Tigers get a starting catcher, platoon 2B, and two live arms in the minors with some serious upside, which appears to be what they’re looking for. It’s not Jarrod Parker, but tough luck. They just offered Jackson to Seattle for Brandon Morrow and Shawn Kelley and were turned down. This is (in my opinion) a good return for Detroit given how desperate they are to shed money. If Snyder really can’t be included due to financial reasons, make them take Byrnes and have us pay all but $1M of the last year of his contract. We need to be cost-efficient here too.
Why it (admittedly probably) wouldn’t work – The D-Backs do unfortunately re-wreck their farm system, a scary thought considering we just spent a ton of picks trying to build it back up from the cellars of baseball, and dealing top-10 guys in the system is a scary thought, and an argument can be made for any of those guys’ inclusion in that list, and it’s a given that many of those guys are included. Also, the Tigers would be hesitant to take Snyder or Byrnes, as I imagine they want to cut as much money from their books as possible with this deal.
One possible addendum that would make things smoother for each party – If the Tigers are interested, perhaps OF Marc Krauss could be included? The guy’s bat and power potential are ridiculous, but his defense is atrocious. He’s a pretty poor fit for Arizona because of our NL status, but if he could go to the AL as a DH-in-training and play the occasional 1B or OF for Interleague Play. He’s got great value because of his bat, and maybe if the Tigers back off of their demand for pitching, Krauss could be very appealing.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And with this mega-comment
Let the feasting begin.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
All-in-all
My best offer would be: Marc Krauss, Bryan Augenstein or Trevor Harden, Ryan Roberts, and Chris Snyder w/o money or Eric Byrnes w/money covering all but $1M of his salary.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
They want young pitching for ..
a young pitcher? And they want to cut money from their books by trading a second year arb guy?
Makes no sense to me.
We need to make sure we’re not trading for a 3.66 ERA guy. Jackson is in for a great deal of regression, based on his peripheral stats. He’s a nice, cost controlled back-of-the-rotation guy, but he’s no Max Scherzer.
by paqs on Dec 8, 2009 2:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I know right?
Apparently his $5M likely arbitration cost is too much. Shows you what’s gone down in Detroit. A couple years ago they poured money on a shaky Dontrelle Willis. Now they’re dealing promising young starters. I agree – Max doesn’t get dealt if we’re smart, and everything but the FoxSports rumor I read has said that.
Question is if we have enough young pitching. Parker does NOT get dealt either. So that means basically Augenstein/Harden/Roemer. I don’t think Buckner fits what they mean by “young pitching.”
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 2:38 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Max for Jackson and Kennedy
Looks like a terrible deal to me. And it says WE’RE pushing for it to happen :(
by paqs on Dec 8, 2009 2:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We aren't...
Every other source I’ve looked at says that Scherzer is not in the deal. We’re probably pushing, but pushing for it not to include Scherzer.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 3:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Although I have to say
The fact that that was put there really does concern me. I haven’t dislike any of JB’s moves at the time of the trade thus far, but I would dislike this one. I don’t see why we’d give up on Max after one year of full-time starting.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 3:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I guess
They believe Kennedy could be a decent starter. For what it’s worth, I don’t think the 20 or so IP in the majors represent his true talent.
Still, Max is really good, and he’s under control for what, 5 more years? I wouldn’t give him up unless we got another 4 WAR guy who is cost controlled.
FanGraphs did a trade value thing a while back, and Max was in the top 50 in the entire league. Here’s the link. So, yeah, DO NOT trade.
by paqs on Dec 8, 2009 3:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
WOW
That’s some crazy stuff… 44? Ahead of Adrian Gonzalez? Yikes.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 3:21 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It's trade value
Adrian Gonzalez is great, but Scherzer will be paid $0.8M for the next 2 years, and then be under arbitration for 3 more.
by paqs on Dec 8, 2009 3:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
I suppose they just tried to aggregate out WAR per season per dollar. Makes sense I suppose.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 10:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
so the big problem is still…..who could we possibly give up (that the tigers want) and somehow still manage to get jackson?
by mfan2010 on Dec 7, 2009 10:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah it would be a good trade if they didnt give up Scherzer
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by ravensfan3 on Dec 7, 2009 11:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
AZ in the rumors
MLBTraderumors is a zoo right now saying there is a potential 3-way between AZ, Detroit and the Yankees. We’d give up Scherzer and get Jackson by their “information”.
I think I can safely go to sleep now confident in the fact Max will still be with us in the monrning. :)
I can’t believe people even give credence to that one.
by Counsellmember on Dec 7, 2009 11:23 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
The rumor now is
Diamondbacks get:
Edwin Jackson
Ian Kennedy
Yankees get:
Curtis Granderson
A couple Diamondbacks prospects
Tigers get:
Max Scherzer
Austin Jackson
Phil Coke
Mike Dunn
As of now the rumor mill says talks are dead. And I hope for our sake, that’s the case. Don’t like this deal at all.
http://letswriteanotherstorytonight.blogspot.com/
by pepperdinedevil on Dec 7, 2009 11:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I love it!
I just love this time of year! It’s a feeding frenzy!
And really, what’s this about “a couple Diamondbacks prospects”? If Im going to start foaming at the mouth, I need Upton’s name mentioned as the PTBNL!
by Counsellmember on Dec 7, 2009 11:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I love this time of year as well!
But not this deal. I want Max here, and our farm is already depleted, in my opinion. There are certainly situations where prospects get “blocked” in the system, so if the prospects were to be in that situation I might feel differently. I feel like Jackson for Scherzer is a lateral move at best, and Max is under team-control for three more years than Jackson is. I just don’t see how this makes a ton of sense.
http://letswriteanotherstorytonight.blogspot.com/
by pepperdinedevil on Dec 7, 2009 11:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why would we trade upton
it would be asinine for jackson and kennedy maybe if we were to get granderson along with jackson.
by BattleMoses on Dec 7, 2009 11:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think there was some sarcasm in his comment.
Upton isn’t going anywhere, for anyone. You can take that to the bank.
http://letswriteanotherstorytonight.blogspot.com/
by pepperdinedevil on Dec 7, 2009 11:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Sorry Moses
Thought my sarcasm was clear enough.
We won’t trade Upton.
We won’t trade Scherzer for Jackson.
I don’t see how a deal even remotely resembling the one listed gets done; especially if its OUR team “pushing” it.
I just get a kick out of the craziness.
by Counsellmember on Dec 7, 2009 11:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
My thoughts exactly
http://letswriteanotherstorytonight.blogspot.com/
by pepperdinedevil on Dec 7, 2009 11:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Meh
Granderson can’t hit lefties. We already have a good outfield with Jackson, Young, and Upton. No way we’re trading scherzer without a heavy return though
"When fascism comes to this country, it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross" - Upton Sinclair
by Zephon on Dec 7, 2009 11:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Someone was syaing we would get hughes or coke
by BattleMoses on Dec 7, 2009 11:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If certain names changed, I might see us "pushing" it.
If it were Hughes or Joba instead of Kennedy, I think you absolutely have to consider that deal.
http://letswriteanotherstorytonight.blogspot.com/
by pepperdinedevil on Dec 7, 2009 11:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There has to be mor than they are reporting.
i bet one of the prospects would be Augenstein
by BattleMoses on Dec 7, 2009 11:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If it's Joba
Or Hughes and Coke. Otherwise, I stay away.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 2:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We're not getting
Joba or Hughes. Come on…
by paqs on Dec 8, 2009 2:56 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well duh.
But I’d do it. :)
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 3:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yes — we’re all agreed. I wouldn’t be too concerned, though. I can’t imagine the FO thinks Edwin Jackson is more valuable than Scherzer. Even taking away the age/arb factor, Scherzer is the better player.
But if Detroit really wants to offload Jackson, I think there’s a deal that can be made here. Checking out their site right now they’ve got Laird penciled in as their starting catcher — Snyder has better upside than him; and they’ve got Ramon Santiago, a career 650 OPS guy, penciled in as their starting 2B. Ryal or Roberts would offer a significant upgrade there. Obviously those two guys aren’t going to get the deal done for Jackson, but they’re a good start to a package if we add some arms to the mix (Gutierrez? Zavada? Schlereth?).
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
by njjohn on Dec 8, 2009 9:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If they're trying to cut payroll
They won’t like paying the $5M for Snyder. Roberts might work.
by paqs on Dec 8, 2009 10:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We'd have to pay some of Snyder's salary
But if we do, that would probably get a deal done. And they’re going to want starting arms, so it’s minor-leaguers. Unless they think Gutierrez can start, which is a little ridiculous.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 10:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I fully expect we’d be sending along cash in this deal if Snyder is involved.
I wasn’t aware of the fact they were wanting SPs. Your options then, obviously, make the most sense. I was just thinking that we have more higher upside/proven relievers lying around than starters.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
by njjohn on Dec 8, 2009 11:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That's true about more proven relievers,
But you have to put “upside” in relative terms. WAR upside for a reliever is lower than for a starter due to the inherent fact that they’re relievers.
On the Snyder subject – say we make the deal so we pay all but $1M-$1.5M of each of Snyder’s next two seasons, with other low-cost pieces, and get Jackson. With Jackson’s arbitration reward expected around $5M, Detroit saves $3.5M-$4M this year, and more next year, and gets a starting catcher. The D-Backs, on the other hand, get a fourth starter for an average cost of $3.5M-$4M this year, leaving us $6M-$6.5M in budget space, much more than we’d expect after acquiring a fourth starter (and a really good one at that). This gives us flexibility to add either a great bullpen arm (since we have a protected first-round pick, getting a Type-A would only cost us a second-rounder), a great bat (we appear to be out of the Nick Johnson run due to a justifiable fear of offering him multi-years, but you can add something potent for $6M-$6.5M), or a solid arm AND a solid bat. That’s a great deal for us, and gives the Tigers some of the savings they want, with cost-efficiency for the future.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 12:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ian Kennedy
We don’t know the prospects involved, and I don’t really like the deal, but I don’t think it’s horrible. Are people that down on Ian Kennedy? His AAA numbers were very good (7-4, 2.14 ERA, 131K/35BB in 126.1 IP. He also pitched well in the AFL (28K/5BB/1HR in 29.2 IP).
As for Jackson, his FIP was 4.28, which isn’t as good as his 3.62 ERA, but he’s probably still a decent #3-4 starter.
Getting two starters for one isn’t a bad idea. I’d prefer Hughes or Chamberlain, but Kennedy has some potential. It’s not a great deal, but I don’t see it as ridiculously bad either.
by Amit on Dec 8, 2009 2:41 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I think
People want to see someone who has had some more success in the majors than Kennedy, hence Hughes and Joba. Then again, Kennedy could be a guy who just doesn’t fit in NY. Those guys do happen. The AL/NL move wouldn’t hurt either. I don’t love it either.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 2:44 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah that would be a disaster
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Dec 8, 2009 11:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
im almost sure Snyder would have to be part of this deal.
by BattleMoses on Dec 7, 2009 11:58 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
And Ryal?
Someone (Pepper, you?) mentioned these two earlier. I would like a deal along those lines, leaving Max with us. The deal as posted really just makes no sense whatsoever.
by Counsellmember on Dec 8, 2009 12:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
id rather not see ryal go why not give them Abreu instead?
by BattleMoses on Dec 8, 2009 12:06 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We just got Abreu
And Abreu is younger than Ryal. Ryal’s old, I’d be perfectly OK letting him go.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:00 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It wasn't me, but I'd probably consider something that looked like
Diamondbacks get:
Edwin Jackson
Phil Hughes
Diamondbacks give:
Max Scherzer
Two of Ryal, Augenstein, Mulvey, Korecky, Buckner, Whitesell
I don’t really see it happening though. We’ll see I guess!
http://letswriteanotherstorytonight.blogspot.com/
by pepperdinedevil on Dec 8, 2009 12:10 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
i still feel like it doesn’t make sense to give up scherzer for jackson, regardless of the other pieces flying around in the trade…scherzer’s a yr younger, K’s more, and we have club control over him for longer…jackson had a crazy good yr last yr, that was partially induced by babip, so i expect some regression
by mfan2010 on Dec 8, 2009 12:15 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I agree
As far as giving up Max for Jackson. I don’t like it. But if that leads to another big arm coming at the price of two lesser prospects (highly unlikely), I think you have to consider it. Like I said – I don’t like, it doesn’t make sense to me, and I don’t think it is remotely plausible.
But that’s the beauty of hot stove season. I can pull trades out my ass and we can all discuss them and bitch at each other. What’s not to love?!
http://letswriteanotherstorytonight.blogspot.com/
by pepperdinedevil on Dec 8, 2009 12:18 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
haha i suppose that’s true…dreaming of a rotation of (healthy) webb, haren, edwin, max
that would be sick
by mfan2010 on Dec 8, 2009 12:24 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Buckner doesn't get any love? :-P
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The two prospects
Would definitely be from a different groups. The Tigers want pitching, and Korecky is garbage, so try this:
Two of Augenstein, Mulvey, Buckner, Schlereth, Harden, Belfiore, Roemer. They’re all good, but it’s going to take good players to pull this off. If we can, we have one of the best rotations in baseball. Has got to be worth it.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Belfiore can't be traded right now
Have to wait at least year after signing with a team to be traded, unless it’s a ptbnl.
"When fascism comes to this country, it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross" - Upton Sinclair
by Zephon on Dec 8, 2009 7:42 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We have nothing against
PTBNL’s.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 10:48 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Unless the Dodgers are trying to scam them out of money they owe them.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
by njjohn on Dec 8, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
+1
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 12:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh my gracious,
Do I love the Winter Meetings.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:02 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Josh Byrnes
if he makes this deal can we call for his resignation, this deal if it goes down will be another Quentin-esque trade that we look back on and say what were we thinking
by dbacks4life on Dec 8, 2009 1:03 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Depends on what deal he makes
If it involves Scherzer and us only getting Jackson and say Kennedy, perhaps. If it’s Jackson and Hughes or Chamberlain, or perhaps not giving up Scherzer, then we have to think about it.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
if Hughes is involved
I’d be uneasy but not reaching for my torch and pitchfork.
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Dec 8, 2009 11:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
as long as scherzer isnt in it i think it might work but with scherzer this trade is a joke and probably wont happen
by dbacks4life on Dec 8, 2009 1:07 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 1:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Snyder for C.J. Wilson?
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Dec 8, 2009 12:11 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
DON'T DO IT DBACKS
DON’T GIVE UP MAXIMO
Hope got in my eyes
by Andrew Martin on Dec 8, 2009 12:15 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Nick Piecoro has some thoughts
Knowing that the Diamondbacks were going to trade five years of RHP Max Scherzer for two (somewhat costly) years of Tigers RHP Edwin Jackson and six years of Yankees RHP Ian Kennedy — it leaves us with two primary thoughts:
1) There’s something the Diamondbacks don’t like about Scherzer.
2) The Diamondbacks highly value Kennedy, more so than most teams.
For what it’s worth, assuming the reported details of this proposed trade are correct, it looks from here like a deal the Diamondbacks are better off not making.
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 8, 2009 12:21 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
LEAVE MAX ALONE!
Indianapolis Colts, taking focus away from my DBacks every Sunday.
by AJforAZ on Dec 8, 2009 12:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is epic win.
"I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it" ~ Mae West
by Blicks on Dec 8, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
3)
Byrnes doesn’t know what he is doing.
by Augie's Army on Dec 8, 2009 2:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well reading Fox....
they imply that the Yanks are hot for Granderson and that the Tigers may be willing to deal him but want a CF in return, the Yanks have a prospect but he’s 22 and hasn’t been above AA. The Dbacks appear to be the team du jour in making it happen…
is it?
Young CF/Sherzer SP -→ Detroit
Jackson SP -—→ Arizona
Kennedy SP -—→ Arizona
Granderson CF -—> Yankees
Not saying that this would be good, but that would open up the OF for someone like Gillespie or Parra (or god forbid, EB) and we get SP in return in Jackson and Kennedy.
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
by piratedan7 on Dec 8, 2009 12:26 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Deal getting closer
Multiple reports saying the deal is getting closer and that Schereth is involved. I DO NOT like the sound of this one bit. This seems totally out of character. A move made by desperation, which we should not be at this point in the off-season.
by Counsellmember on Dec 8, 2009 1:05 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Except
that there’s a very real possibility in both Schlereth’s case AND Scherzer’s case that their arms might fall off at any given time.
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 1:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Risk with all pitchers
Kennedy already HAS had injuries. And Jackson had a career year, not the time to buy on him.
I know there is risk with both our guys, but I have seen nor heard anything other than speculation that it MIGHT happen. You can’t run a club that way.
by Counsellmember on Dec 8, 2009 1:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I buy this one
I really really like Jackson. The kid is young and knows how to pitch and dominate at this level. A move to the NL would make him lethal. I wish we didn’t have to give up Scherzer for it, but honestly with his delivery he is a year or two away from some type of serious injury. Jackson has a smooth delivery and consistently hits the upper 90s, I for one would be in favor of us getting Jackson.
by rapdawg on Dec 8, 2009 1:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t mind the inclusion of Schlereth. He’s a good pitcher, but has much more limited value than Scherzer based on the likelihood for injury and the fact that he’s a reliever.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
by njjohn on Dec 8, 2009 1:25 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well if you consider
that Jackson and Kennedy would give us SP 3 and 4 in the rotation for a 3 and a LOOGY, woudln’t you have to cosnider that deal? Unless you had visions of Schlereth being a closer (don’t think he’s ready but he could be groomed for it I suppose). Heck there have been those clamoring to move Max to the closer’s spot as well….
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
by piratedan7 on Dec 8, 2009 1:19 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
It almost seems like
a deal designed with 2010 in mind…. but not so much 2011 or later.
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 1:21 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
True...
So, in jackson lets say you have a #3 pitcher for 2 years of arbitration $$.
In Kennedy you have a #4 pitcher for 5(?) years currently in pre-arb.
In Scherzer you have a #2 pitcher for 5 years currently pre-arb
In Schereth you have a first round pick with 6(?) years
Still don’t like it. This is not a deal we have to make, with our backs against the wall. We have 10+ mil to spend and trade chips in Byrnes and Synder to drop a small amount of payroll on top of it. Unless we are trying to utterly screw someone with a bum pitcher, I absolutely hate this deal.
by Counsellmember on Dec 8, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Byrnes is not a trade chip. The D’backs will have to pay a team $10M to take him. Snyder has more trade value than Byrnes, but still not very much.
This trade would give the team two starting pitchers for $5-6M. The D’backs must feel there is no free agent SP they would rather have for that kind of money.
by Amit on Dec 8, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Steve Gilbert reports
“FOXsports.com, which originally broke the story about the trade, says it’s now possible that the Tigers and Yankees will come to an agreement on their own and not include the D-backs.”
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 8, 2009 1:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Please, God.
What's your name? Sandwich. What's your first name? TUNA.
by emilylovesthedbacks on Dec 8, 2009 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Can Josh Byrnes please not make the Yankees and Tigers better
This is an absolutely absurd trade.
"I generally avoid temptation unless I can't resist it" ~ Mae West
by Blicks on Dec 8, 2009 1:27 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Because, ya know,
we should only deal with…. what? Japanese League teams?
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Them and the Rockies
We’ll take Scherzer and Schlereth from you
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Dec 8, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
No.
Needz moar Edwin Jackson.
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 1:34 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
How about JDLR instead
he iz moar bettor
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Dec 8, 2009 1:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nah.
There’s something about JDLR that makes us wanna trade him immediately, everytime we get him.
He just burns a hole in our pockets, or something.
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I AM kinda surprised, though,
that we haven’t traded with the A’s or ChiSox yet.
Maybe the Tony Peña for Brandon Allen trade got the ChiSox out of our system. At least for another year.
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 1:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Heyman reporting it as a done deal
Hope got in my eyes
by Andrew Martin on Dec 8, 2009 1:43 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
teams in agreement on trade. assuming medicals check out, it’s a go.
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 8, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well,
at least our name got in the paper :)
by Counsellmember on Dec 8, 2009 1:54 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
wanna bet that the medical on Kennedy
is gonna be the make or break on this deal.
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
by piratedan7 on Dec 8, 2009 1:56 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't be shocked.
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 2:06 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Wait....
So Max is gone for who again? What the hell is going on.
BTW. Hi guys, havnt been on since the season ended.
"Yeah I could have been king, but maybe I already am king. Hail to the king baby." Ash from Army of Darkness
by Turambar on Dec 8, 2009 1:57 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Max Scherzer and Daniel Schlereth
for Ian Kennedy and Edwin Jackson.
New York gets Curtis Granderson, and Detroit gets Scherzer and Schlereth, plus cheap prospects from the Yanks…. hmmm… something something urban renewal Detroit joke.
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 2:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
are any DBACKS fans 4 this trade, great job of alienating your fanbase Josh
by dbacks4life on Dec 8, 2009 1:58 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
The same fanbase
that bitched until Jeff Moorad re-signed Eric Byrnes?
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 1:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
FTW
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 2:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And Josh Byrnes
gives me another reason to drink. Everyone who had March 1 or later in the pool is a sucka for taking the over.
Max & Schlereth for Edwin Jackson & Ian Kennedy how does this make any sense?
by Augie's Army on Dec 8, 2009 1:59 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Schlereth doesn't bother me if he's in this
His control is seriously out of wack. And he has arm risks. So he needs time to fix control, but doesn’t have much time due to injury. But Scherzer does. He was a bona fide #3… I don’t get it.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 2:01 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I agree on Schlereth
I don’t really get swapping scherzer though. This doesn’t seem like that big of an upgrade, and we lose a lot of years of control here. I mean yes Kennedy>schlereth IMO, but is Jackson really an improvement over scherzer?
"When fascism comes to this country, it will be wrapped in a flag and carrying a cross" - Upton Sinclair
by Zephon on Dec 8, 2009 2:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I dunno..
Jackson is a big upgrade over Scherzer imho, Schlereth (who has been touted on these same boards as a wasted #1 pick) looks like a LOOGY in closer’s clothing. Kennedy gives them another option at 4/5 along with Buckner, Augenstein, Mulvey.
We have Kennedy for 6 years, jackson for two, more than enough time for Parker to recover and some of the other young arms to progress.
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
by piratedan7 on Dec 8, 2009 2:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Jackson
Had a BABIP-enhanced season… I don’t like the Scherzer-for-Jackson trade-off. And Kennedy… ehh…
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 2:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Kennedy
What has Kennedy shown that gives anyone the idea that he will be healthy or good enough to be around 6 years?
by Augie's Army on Dec 8, 2009 2:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Pending his physical?
It would be hilarious if the deal fell apart from that. Clearly we’re going to take a LONG look at him.
Most Depressing Math Question Ever courtesy of Probability class: "Clark and Anthony are two old friends. Let A be the event that Clark will attend Anthony's funeral. Let B be the event that Anthony will attend Clark's funeral. Are A and B independent? Why or why not?"
by IHateSouthBend on Dec 8, 2009 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
well substitute Scherzer for Kennedy
and you can ask the same question.
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
by piratedan7 on Dec 8, 2009 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Max has made more that 14 starts in 3 seasons and if he can’t hack it as a starter could move to the pen.
by Augie's Army on Dec 8, 2009 2:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just waiting for some external confirmation this is done
Beyond Jon Heyman’s Twitter, and I’ll post a new story on this.
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 8, 2009 2:04 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I'm waiting for Piecoro to confirm it
before believing it.
Dbacks return to the WS in 2010?
Hey, it could happen.
by DbacksSkins on Dec 8, 2009 2:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is called the denial phase of mourning
"I have no special talents. I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
by Andrew T. Fisher on Dec 8, 2009 2:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Steve Gilbert says "Looks like the three-way trade is going to happen."
That’ll do for me. Please follow me to the new thread
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 8, 2009 2:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
What's your name? Sandwich. What's your first name? TUNA.
by emilylovesthedbacks on Dec 8, 2009 2:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
i think jackson is a slightly better version of scherzer, at least right now…but the fact that we would only have him for 2 years vs scherzer for five is really worrisome….and the tradeoff overall seems really weird from a short term standpt
jackson will be paid somewhere between 5-6 mil this yr right? so getting jackson and kennedy vs. scherzer and 8 mil FA…
i guess there must be something about kennedy we really really like, and something about scherzer that we really don’t like…
by mfan2010 on Dec 8, 2009 2:10 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Or something about winning...
we really really don’t like.
by Counsellmember on Dec 8, 2009 2:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Looks like a done deal, so new thread posted
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 8, 2009 2:12 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
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