So what are the Dbacks going to do with Eric Byrnes?
by C. Wesley Baier on Dec 22, 2009 9:40 AM EST
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PrintWhat is the FO waiting for? Eric Byrnes is a wonderful person, but he's a terrible baseball player at this point. The team is better without him at this point. All the discussion i've heard about roster construction, lineup construction basically has Byrnes as a non-factor. He's a sunk cost at this point. So why haven't we heard any news about the team trying to move byrnes? Why haven't we heard any discussion about the team thinking about flat out releasing him? Are they just waiting till spring training to cut him? What's going on here? When are they going to make a move to get rid of this guy? Are we going to keep him? Is he going to be the most overpaid 5th outfielder in history? I'd just like to get everyone's opinion here, hence the poll.
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They're
probably waiting to see what happens during Spring Training. Patience is a virtue.
An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.
well maybe
they’re waiting to see if he’ll accept a demotion to team mascot.
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
Oops,
I see I’ve been beaten to the punch.
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
by DbacksSkins on Dec 22, 2009 10:58 AM EST up reply actions
Put him
in the Baxter suit.
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
I think I've mentioned it before, but...
“And I guess that was your outfielder in the wood chipper.”
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
+(Over 9000!!!!!)
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 22, 2009 5:56 PM EST up reply actions
Less facetiously
I think they’ll see how things unfold. If they get any kind of trade offer, I imagine they’ll be all over it. But in the (likely) absence of any deals, they’ll see how things unfold in spring and early on in the season. We’re paying him, probably regardless of anything else, so might as well see if he is better than replacement level. If so, great. If not, cut him loose and call up a replacement level outfielder.
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
Oooh.... oooh......
wait, you were being facetious?
Well, crap.
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
Eric Byrnes + Contract Year > Replacement Level Player
Im still miffed there was not a Bradley for Byrnes contract swap.
However, in his defense, I think Byrnes is being overlooked a bit owing to the awful first two years of his deal. No denying, we got screwed by that contract, but what’s done is done. Here are the factors I see that have relevance:
-Injuries: broken hand in 09 and hamstring in 08. The hamstring should be healed by now and the hand was just bad luck. These are both injuries that are difficult to come back from immediately and play at full speed, but should be good by spring.
-Last Two Healthy Seasons: 2006 and 2007 .813 and .795 OPS, 75 sb, 47HR
-Last Two Injury Seasons: 2008 and 2009. His numbers were terrible when he did play, but some of that may have been injury related, as I mentioned before. Also, .226 and .229 BAbip during those years. So, even more bad luck on top of it. And those are still bad numbers even if he pops up more than average.
-Defense: Defense doesn’t slump. Career LF: 5.6 URX/150 Career CF: 11.1 URZ/150
This is the area in which I really think he gets a bad rap, due to his silly play style. But these are good defensive numbers. I find CF particularly interesting.
Bottom line is that I think there is real value here. If we agree that his 11M is a “sunk cost”, then we are basically looking at whether or not we want Eric Byrnes for free on a one year deal. Compare that to Winn or Kelly Johnson in the outfield or someone else for 2-4M.
And in regards to Byrnes’ CF defense, I think CY is an even bigger question mark for us. The more I look at his numbers, the more I see a gaping hole. It would be nice to have a fall back option to put Byrnes in CF. Especially since it looks more and more like Jackson will be at first, making Parra full time at LF.
by Counsellmember on Dec 22, 2009 12:37 PM EST reply actions
Parra in LF
needs to be platooned with someone who can hit lefthanded pitching.
by dbacks watcher on Dec 22, 2009 12:48 PM EST up reply actions
I said we should salary dump him and get whatever player we can get. But I think your reasoning here is solid, Counsellmember. I don’t think anyone expects him to return to 2006/07, but perhaps he could get closer to that, and his defense is definitely very good, even if irritating in style. No reason keeping him on as a 5th OF would hurt, especially with the dearth of RH bats on this team.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
I understand all of this
And it’s very well outlined and argued, but my biggest question is what happens to Cole Gillespie? He was 107th on scout.com’s list of top prospects in all of baseball going into 2009 and had a monster season in AAA (perhaps Reno-inflated, but he also performed well in the AFL). I think Gillespie can be a guy who we platoon with Parra in LF, keep Jackson at first, give Allen another year at AAA with call-up in September for a bench bat and defensive sub, and CY in CF with the occasional day where Parra and Gillespie play by having Parra in CF and Gillespie in LF when CY needs a rest.
I feel like Gillespie has more long-term potential than a lot of people give him credit for, and he’s a machine in getting on-base. So why keep Byrnes when we know his long-term value to this team is zero when we can see what we have in terms of long-term value from Gillespie? Especially if we can find a team to salary dump Byrnes on for a fringy prospect or two. Heck, if we pay all of EB’s salary, we could probably get a decent low-level relief arm or something of that sort.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 22, 2009 6:03 PM EST up reply actions
Full outfield
Your comments do more to make me believe that we should not be signing any more players to the outfield this off-season, i.e. Randy Winn.
I agree that Gillespie needs a shot. The question is how to do that and get the most production from the two available positions (LF and CF). For me, Chris Young’s name has to be mentioned in that conversation, because he may have lower production and worse defense than someone like, oh say, Eric Byrnes. Young’s terrible splits against RHP may call for yet another platoon, of which I am growing tired.
by Counsellmember on Dec 22, 2009 7:03 PM EST up reply actions
Could become the Byrnes replacement
But we’ll be paying Byrnes’ $12m [or the vast bulk thereof] regardless, so we might as well see whether he can be of any value to the team first.
We could gain by not needlessly starting Gillespie’s arbitration clock, if Eric Byrnes is performing adequately. I also do think Gillespie’s numbers were Reno inflated. His 932 OPS there put him between Brandon Allen and Josh Whitesell, neither of whom sustained anything like that level in the majors.
Away from Reno, his line was .276/.357/.431 – not disastrous, but a .788 OPS isn’t going to translate well to the majors. His AFL performance was good, but given most of the pitchers there were Double-A level, I’d expect someone who spent basically all year at Triple-A to rake them. So, I’m not yet convinced he is the future, and would not want to commit full-time to him as a first alternative.
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 22, 2009 7:22 PM EST up reply actions
I get that we want to try to get value from EB
But I don’t see Gillespie as much of a downgrade, if at all. Home/road splits are one thing if they’re greater than usual, but there’s typically going to be some kind of split. Also, Gillespie’s a guy who doesn’t strike out with the frequency of Allen or Whitesell, and that was their greatest issue. Gillespie’s actually great at limiting those K’s, and getting on-base, rather than being a one-tool power machine with the bat (at this point – I think Allen will develop into more).
Further, Gillespie’s going to be 26 next year, so the arbitration clock isn’t a huge concern, at least for me…
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 22, 2009 7:58 PM EST up reply actions
Home/road splits are one thing if they’re greater than usual, but there’s typically going to be some kind of split.
Of course, but when the splits are 150-odd points apart, then you have to wonder what is the driving factor. It’s clear that Reno in 2009 had a huge effect on players’ numbers, and looking at a player’s stats elsewhere would seem to me a good benchmark of their “true” level of talent. Gillespie’s .788 road OPS when in Reno, for example, is a great deal closer to the number he posted in Triple-A before his trade to Arizona (.756). What’s more likely? He suddenly discovered how to hit immediately after he was traded? Or playing in Reno artificially-inflated his stats?
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 23, 2009 12:54 AM EST up reply actions
You also ought to take into account
His BABIP from his time in the Milwaukee system this year. I believe Wes first mentioned to me how he was due for regression.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 23, 2009 5:14 AM EST up reply actions
Gillespie
I think you are overrating Gillespie a little. His stats at AAA Nashville (.242/.332/.424 in 277 PA) were not good. His stats at Reno were better (.304/.418/.514 in 170 PA), but are not that great for the PCL. That likely translates to a mediocre BA in the majors and below average power for a corner outfielder.
He might be better than Eric Byrnes, but I don’t see a lot of upside here.
I'm sorry,
I guess I forgot that all decent hitters at Reno post OPS’s over 1.000…
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 23, 2009 5:14 AM EST up reply actions
Chris Young and Brandon Allen
The only Reno players with 25+ PAs to have an OPS over 1.000. How did they do in the majors? OPS+ of 80 and 69.
I’m basically discounting all Reno numbers as evidence of major-league hitting ability, until proven otherwise.
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 23, 2009 10:32 AM EST up reply actions
There's a lot more to it than that suggests
CY is more of a complex issue than straight OPS translation. His mechanics and confidence were shot in the majors prior to that minors assignment, and those numbers have the greater sway on his overall season numbers than his post-Reno numbers, because whatever Bill Butler did down there helped him enormously. How’d he fare after his trip to Reno when he posted that OPS over 1.000? September OPS of .843 and a four-game October stint of 1.295 OPS. So, maybe it’s just me, but that can basically be thrown out as an example because we simply don’t know what’s there.
As for Allen, sure, he was pretty awful, but one example does not mean that you suddenly have no good AAA bat prospects, regardless of their production.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 23, 2009 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
No, but it does make me doubt numbers posted in Reno
- Brandon Allen. Reno OPS 1.055 : Major-league OPS .669
- Josh Whitesell: Reno OPS: .869 Major-league OPS: .633
- Young: Reno OPS: 1.127 Major-league OPS (post-return): .859
That’s an average drop-off of 297 points, comparing over 500 PAs in Reno, to almost 400 in the majors. Until proven otherwise, that’s the kind of drop-off I’d be expecting from Gillespie. The resulting OPS of .635 isn’t an improvement over Eric Byrnes.
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 23, 2009 5:32 PM EST up reply actions
I missed a couple
Alex Romero: .879 → .644
Trent Oeltjen: .862 → .707
That reduces the average dropoff to about 256 points, but is now based on around 1,250 PAs in Reno and abour 650 in the majors.
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 23, 2009 5:59 PM EST up reply actions
What makes me comfortable with Gillespie
Is his propensity to not strike out. Think of all of those other guys (again excluding CY because I consider him a unique case – of course he’s not going to have an OPS of 1.127 in the major leagues… be reasonable here). With the possible exception of Romero (who did a better job than that OPS will indicate due to his lack of HR power – but he gets on base), all of those guys struck out too much to make it in the majors. Allen’s K’s ruined his good raw power, Whitesell’s K’s ruined his limited raw power which didn’t translate and is AAAA power. And Oeltjen couldn’t hit a breaking ball to save his life. Gillespie doesn’t K as much as any of those guys, which makes me more optimistic that he can get on base at a higher rate than EB, which is what I’d rather have from our 4/5th OF.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 23, 2009 7:59 PM EST up reply actions
Dammit
I can’t believe i’m agreeing with you on this, but you made some extremely valid points. Still think I’d rather see gillespie and parra though.
by C. Wesley Baier on Dec 22, 2009 8:12 PM EST up reply actions
Eric Byrnes=Waste of roster space
RELEASE HIM ASAP! He is NOT doing this team any good!
"AUGIE AUGIE AUGIE...OY OY OY!"
What we should do with Byrnes you say ???
Invite him over to my house. We gets some drinks in my bar, play some bones maybe some spades and do shots of all sorts of scotch. I’ll then use my verbal powers of persuasion and convince him to do the right thing and just let me play for him. At 1st people would be confused because I am much more handsome and a better player. But they would eventually get over it as soon as they see my triple flip throw to home. Nuff said bros. Close poll.
I laugh until my head comes off.
by edbigghead on Dec 22, 2009 4:15 PM EST reply actions 4 recs
Sweeet....
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
Let's see how he does in Spring Training
We’re paying him anyway, I don’t think anyone will take him, so why not give him a chance to show he can do better?
"I can just see it: Post 'Intervention? Why would I need an intervention?' And then he'd +1 himself."
Get
your reasonable response out of here!
An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.
But! But! It's the internet!
Where will I go?
"I can just see it: Post 'Intervention? Why would I need an intervention?' And then he'd +1 himself."
kishi, did you know Adolf Hitler also wanted to give Eric Byrnes a chance in Spring Training?
(There. It’s not the internet until somebody compares you to the Nazis.)
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
by DbacksSkins on Dec 23, 2009 4:56 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
well Chuck Norris wanted to be Eric Byrnes
but found out he wasn’t fragile enough….
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
No no no
“As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1.”
Geez.
An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.
Yes, I know the theory.
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
Well
then quote it right, you homp.
An early departure? What are the chances of that? If this was a movie, there wouldn't be an early departure.
I
do not appreciate that!
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
Pedro Cerrano: Jesus, I like him very much, but he no help with curveball.
Eddie Harris: You trying to say Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?
+1
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 25, 2009 8:29 PM EST up reply actions
The short-term potential EB offers
Is significantly less than the long-term potential Cole Gillespie offers. Keeping Gillespie in AAA for another year is pointless. Bring the kid up, pay Byrnes’ salary and trade him for a low-level live relief arm with some serious control problems and see if we can’t sort him out (or something of that sort).
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 22, 2009 6:05 PM EST reply actions
"Have you seen Nermal?"
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 22, 2009 7:59 PM EST up reply actions
How about Mike Lowell?
Now that Boston’s deal with Texas has collapsed why not go after Lowell in exchange for Eric Byrnes? Boston really seems to want Adrian Gonzalez. The rumor in New England is they could trade Jacoby Ellsbury and Clay Buckholz to get him and then move Kevin Youkilis back to third making Lowell surplus.
Mike Cameron would take Ellsbury’s spot in center, but left is definitely open and Drew remains a huge injury risk in right. A player who can play all three outfield positions and is right handed could be attractive as a contract swap if both players prove they are health in Spring Training.
Lowell could be the right handed solution at first if he is healthy
But Lowell
Is not healthy. He needs surgery on his torn ligament in his thumb and will be out for quite a while. I’d rather we go after a FA than try to turn Byrnes into a mediocre, oft-injured platoon-mate for Allen in order to save the $2-3M it would cost for a reliable platoon-mate, which we could afford.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 22, 2009 9:31 PM EST up reply actions
Too many platoons!
This would be Melvin’s dream lineup! He could go an entire year without duplicating the lineup once.
I like th idea of Lowell in theory, though. One could hope that by placing him at 1st he might stay a little more healthy. And I think his bat would fit our lineup well, especially battling in the AL East for the last four years.
And I bet the Sox badly want to unload him right now. In a trade for EB they might even kick in a few million more just to get it done.
Buuut, the health. Hard to get past the health.
by Counsellmember on Dec 23, 2009 1:37 AM EST up reply actions
It’s not a bad idea at all, really. Especially since it’s likely that we could get Lowell + cash for Byrnes. We could keep CoJack in LF, where he’s better suited, and Lowell could be Allen’s platoonmate. The health is a big concern, but really, if Lowell is healthy his performance is guaranteed to be better than Byrnes’. And he won’t block anyone in the system like Byrnes does.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
This makes sense
At the very least as a money-saving maneuver. But does Boston want EB? They were just about to get Max Ramirez, considered a top prospect, and now they’re going to settle for a washed-up, injury-prone 30-something year old OF who fans in the city he plays in hates? The dancing in the streets that would be guaranteed to ensue if this were to go down pretty much means it’s not going to go down…
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 23, 2009 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
should be
starting left fielder with CoJack at 1B
Professional Lurker... if you see this, there may be a problem..
Eric Byrnes?
Really??
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
It could work out I suppose
But I just don’t see it… I suppose he did turn it on a little bit after his extended rehab assignment in Reno…
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 25, 2009 8:31 PM EST up reply actions
Might I say,
we have a lot of leftover air time on Fox Sports AZ to fill as well as the fact that that Mike guy (who pairs with Vanessa in the in game entertainment) .needs to be DFA’ed.
by Reynolds rapper on Dec 27, 2009 1:55 AM EST reply actions
Mike and Vanessa
should BOTH be DFA’d.
I am in full agreement with Diamondhacks on this matter.
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
by DbacksSkins on Dec 28, 2009 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
DFA'ed!
DFA’ed…
LOL!
I am SO glad they DFA’ed…or 86’ed…Byrnesie’s STUPID tv show! The ONLY episode I liked (other than the Saulo Morris one) was the Fantasy Football episode last season…my favourite part? "I don’t care if I win the prize…I’m just here to talk shit to Eric Byrnes!"
I <3 you Augie!
“AUGIE AUGIE AUGIE…OY OY OY!”
"AUGIE AUGIE AUGIE...OY OY OY!"
I actually
kinda liked The Eric Byrnes Show…. I mean, it was awful, but it WAS sometimes entertaining.
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
by DbacksSkins on Dec 28, 2009 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
Fire him!
Out of a cannon. Into the sun.
Seriously, since he pretty much delivers replacement level performance, it’s a sunk cost anyway. If we can trade him away and save a million, it’s better than nothing.
+1
I LOL’d.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 29, 2009 2:29 PM EST up reply actions
With the signing of Kelly Johnson
We’re really in a bind with the position players on our 25 man roster. Getting rid of byrnes is the only thing makes sense. Salary dump or DFA ASAP!
by C. Wesley Baier on Dec 29, 2009 8:55 PM EST reply actions
+1
Too many position players. Byrnes is the weakest link. Goodbye.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 30, 2009 12:00 AM EST up reply actions
Want to agree, can't
I’m still waiting for the Jim’s CF article to really get into the meat of it, but I think we’ve got another candidate for weakest link on the team.
His name starts with a C, end with a G and in the middle is hrisyoun.
It’s a totally different situation than Byrnes, but I think he needs to be in the conversation.
by Counsellmember on Dec 30, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions
Byrnes has one year left
And no upside. CY has until 2013 (or 2014, I can’t remember) and has a ton of upside still. Both are good defensively, so that’s a wash. And both has similar offensive seasons in ’09. Seems simple to me.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 30, 2009 4:54 PM EST up reply actions
Not so simple
Like I said and you pointed out, totally different situations. The years under control is the most relevant factor, I think. However,
“CY…has a ton of upside still”
Does he? Almost 2000 PA and a line of .235/.307/.438. I can grudgingly agree with you he has more upside than Byrnes, but we have to stop thinking about CY as a blue chip prospect.
“Both are good defensively, so that’s a wash”
Can’t agree there. Young has a reputation for great outfield defense, but his career Urz/150 is -4.9. Byrnes is the opposite because of the antics everyone hates, but his career in CF is 11.1. Plus he has experience throughout the OF.
“similar offensive seasons in ’09”
Two different seasons. Hard to judge Byrnes at all last year because of the injuries. Young had a nice last month, but didnt have his head screwed on the rest of the season.
In the end, I think the years under control make it impossible to ignore Young. But if we are talking about who will be the weakest link in ’10, I think CY needs to at least be in the conversation. And his future needs to be seriously debated amongst the FO.
by Counsellmember on Dec 30, 2009 5:33 PM EST up reply actions
Well, we clearly disagree on things
I think CY can definitely get back to his rookie-year numbers, and better them. The 30 HRs are probably a best-bet scenario, but the guy really learned how to draw a walk in the latter parts of last year, which was lost amidst the mechanical problems in his swing. If he fixes that, I can see improvements.
I’ve never had any problems with CY’s defense. Defensive metrics can certainly be tricky, and CY definitely took his bat out into center field last year, so that’s going to factor in to some extent. Byrnes is a good defender, sure, but there’s nothing else, really. Byrnes has small upside in ‘10 to maybe be healthy for the first time in forever and put up a decent season, but it’s not worth cutting loose CY for one mediocre season of EB. That’s worth a salary-dump trade for another team to try him out at $1M maybe.
Numbers-wise, they’re fairly similar. And if you’re going to nitpick, CY’s were better, and probably will be again in 2010, since nobody really expects EB to hold up for a full season. Actually had an OBP over .300 (.311 vs. a disgusting .270), and had a better slugging (.400 vs. .393). We saw a glimpse of hope from CY. Byrnes? Not quite so much (although he finished the year stronger than he began it, to be sure).
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 30, 2009 7:57 PM EST up reply actions
I perhaps came on too strong
I don’t mean to suggest I would pick Byrnes over Young flat out. The contract, age and potential all make Young the clear pick to start the season as our CF. I guess I’m just a little more bullish about Byrnes, and a little more sheepish about Young than most others, at least you and njjohn :)
I think CY can definitely get back to his rookie-year numbers, and better them
I hope so, because this is really what it all hinges on for me. Young has a career OPS+ of 86 and a line of .235/.307/.438 while batting for 3.5 seasons at Chase. Does that not worry you? And none of that can be blamed on an injury from what I remember. I won’t argue he’s got great upside, but how long a leash will you give him this year? A full year if we’re competing?!?
I’ve never had any problems with CY’s defense. Defensive metrics can certainly be tricky, and CY definitely took his bat out into center field last year, so that’s going to factor in to some extent
I agree. I was just pointing out that the metrics like Byrnes quite a bit more than Young. But if I had to make a stab at scouting, I would think it was the other way around. I’ll take Young on defense.
by Counsellmember on Dec 30, 2009 9:29 PM EST up reply actions
Young has a career OPS+ of 86 and a line of .235/.307/.438 while batting for 3.5 seasons at Chase. Does that not worry you?
Absolutely. And I don’t think CY deserves a year-long leash. Depending on how awful he is and how well Parra/Byrnes/Gillespie are playing, that leash may not be more than a couple months long. But he’s got to get the starting gig out of camp. And there is NO way he can be DFA’d, as you suggest.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
Never
And there is NO way he can be DFA’d, as you suggest.
Never suggested it. Don’t believe it. I have been framed! :)
by Counsellmember on Dec 30, 2009 10:08 PM EST up reply actions
ORLY?
In response to this comment:
Getting rid of byrnes is the only thing makes sense. Salary dump or DFA ASAP!
You say:
I think we’ve got another candidate for weakest link on the team.
His name starts with a C, end with a G and in the middle is hrisyoun.
I don’t think I was crazy to connect the dots that way.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
Actually
In fact, it was a response to this comment:
Too many position players. Byrnes is the weakest link. Goodbye.
I just wanted to say I didn;t think it was cut and dry that Byrnes was the “weakest link” next year. But I can see the confusion.
by Counsellmember on Dec 30, 2009 11:31 PM EST up reply actions
Don't forget
A good chunk of his value came in stolen bases. He has the potential to be an above-average contributor offensively even with average or slightly below average (emphasis on slightly) offensive numbers. And CF is a position where defense is more sought after than offense as well, because of the physical demands of the position.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 30, 2009 11:33 PM EST up reply actions
Agree
It’s all true. But another of those worries for me about Young is that speed is only effective offensively when combined with getting on base. Career OBP .307 really limits CY’s use of that weapon. I think batting in front of the pitcher might be in order to get him on base a handful more times next year.
Again,agree with the defense, but my Magic 8 Ball is cloudy when I ask about his defense. Perhaps there will be a more thurough analysis of the D in the upcoming centerfielder post.
by Counsellmember on Dec 31, 2009 11:24 AM EST up reply actions
And even with that OBP
he stole 25 his rookie year. I’m not saying he doesn’t need to improve his OBP, but he definitely picked up his walk-rate in ‘09, and if he can both maintain that rate and return his BABIP to its former position (this is more than simple regression, this is keeping his swing mechanics in check), then he’ll arguably put up a better season in ’10 than his rookie year.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 31, 2009 4:31 PM EST up reply actions
He stole 25
with an OBP actually below .300, IIRC.
"The existence of flamethrowers is proof that someone, somewhere, said to himself, 'I want to set those people over there on fire, but I don't feel like walking over there to do it.'"
Yup, .295
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Jan 1, 2010 7:33 PM EST up reply actions
Thing is, he’ll probably never steal at that rate again. But if he can get his OBP around 330, he can still get 25.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
Well,
If we don’t set him loose like we did that year, probably not. I think if CY starts to produce up to expectations in ‘10, then he could have the confidence to bet set loose on the basepaths again. I’d be all for that.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Jan 2, 2010 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
“Blue chip prospect”?? Come now, Counsellmember, let’s not attack a straw man, here. No one is arguing that CY is a “blue chip prospect” any longer. All that we’re saying (or at least all that I would say) is that we think that CY has the potential to be a valuable contributor to the club and perhaps could even be an above average contributor. Byrnes on the other hand has injury question marks and age question marks not present with CY… and a heck of a shorter contract. There’s no question CY is a better bet.
"Love is the most important thing in the world, but baseball is pretty good too. " ~Greg, age 8
I'm sure
We can get someone to eat at least a million or two for his salary, and use him as a fifth outfielder/defensive replacement/pop up specialist.
What do you mean no one needs a pop up specialist?
+1
Hehe. Pop-up specialist. For teams wanting to look like they’ve had bad luck with overall BABIP when people are too lazy to look into it more and notice the pop-ups? Like Kansas City if they want to be able to say their offense is primed for a 2011 breakout to shoot them into division title contention. Or something…….
But seriously, we ought to be able to do this. He’s an upside shot for everyday-like production if he’s healthy and everything (and boy, do I mean everything) is clicking, and at least is a defensive replacement and pinch-runner type.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 30, 2009 3:13 AM EST up reply actions
well here's a thought
send him to the Red Sox or the Yankees by telling everyone that the Angels are interestd in him.
I used to be disgusted, now I try to be amused....
FTW
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 30, 2009 5:26 AM EST up reply actions
EVERYTHING clicking!
LMAO! The ONLY thing clicking on Byrnesie these days is that whacked-out brain of his…he reminds me of Jeff Spicolli in a baseball uniform (and no I don’t mean Khalil Greene either LOL)…I can just hear Eric saying “Dude,, I’m so wasted! I need me some tasty waves man!”
Send him packing…and SOON!
*I still haven’t figured out how to post an image in my comments here…can anyone tell me how this can be done…or if it can be done?
"AUGIE AUGIE AUGIE...OY OY OY!"
by Rockkstarr12 on Dec 30, 2009 12:45 PM EST up reply actions
Posting an image
You need first to know the URL/address of the image, so it already has to be online somewhere [Photobucket, Flickr, or any other web page. If it’s on another page, you can right-click the image and choose ‘Properties’ – that’ll give you the address you need to use.
Once you’ve got that click the icon of a tree that appears in the line between the comment subject and your text, then put in the URL of your pic. Hit ok, and it’ll insert the code. I’d hit ‘Preview’ to make sure it displays right, as once you hit Post, it’s too late to change.
Note that too many images or big images make the page load like it’s wading through molasses, especially on mobile devices. So use ’em sparingly!
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 30, 2009 2:51 PM EST up reply actions
Like for Fargo references
Because everybody likes Fargo references.
"I've had Bailey's out of a shoe, though."
by Dan Strittmatter on Dec 30, 2009 4:57 PM EST up reply actions
It's very quotable
:-)
"Win, or die" -- Marquise de Merteuil
by Jim McLennan on Dec 30, 2009 5:26 PM EST up reply actions
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