The Diamondbacks get Jon Garland. In other news, "Randy who?"
| Age | Cost | Starts | IP | ERA+ | IP/Start | HR/9 | BB/9 | |
| PitcherA |
45 | $8-13m | 73 | 445.2 | 103 | 6.11 | 1.19 | 2.37 |
| PitcherB | 29 | $6.25m | 96 | 616.1 | 102 | 6.42 | 0.99 | 2.29 |
Really, we've all made more difficult decisions than that. While the ERA+ are almost identical, Pitcher B is younger, cheaper, more durable, goes deeper into games and has better peripherals, allowing many less home-runs as well as walking fewer batters. And that was all in the AL, facing the DH. Of course, it goes without saying that Pitcher A is Randy Johnson, now signed with the Giants, while Pitcher B is Jon Garland, who will be playing for the Diamondbacks in 2009. In your face, San Francisco! Our pitcher is better, less expensive and much more attractive than yours! Who's sorry now?
Okay, to some [arguably, a great!] extent, this is driven largely by cherry-picking statistics, but I think it's safe to say that Garland is a much better pitcher for the Diamondbacks to acquire than we thought we might get. Frankly, I'd have been satisfied with anyone whose count of functioning limbs exceeded tjhree. Getting someone young and halfway decent - under thirty and with a career ERA+ above a hundred (104, to be precise) - is definitely a good catch. He's certainly an innings eater, with seven straight season of 32 starts or more, and he will fit nicely into the Diamondbacks philosophy of signing such pitchers.
Over the past four seasons, only twenty pitchers in the majors have started 128 games or more. Four of them will be in the 2009 Arizona rotation:
=2nd. Dan Haren, 135 starts
=6th. Brandon Webb, 134 starts
=18th. Doug Davis, 128 starts
=18th. Jon Garland, 128 starts
By innings pitched, we will have the #1 [Webb, 927 IP], #5 [Haren, 878.2], #14 [Garland, 837.1] and #24 [Davis, 764.2]. Putting those numbers together, our fantastic four should be good for 131 starts and 852 innings, should they prove to be average. If Scherzer [or whatever many-headed beast ends up being the number five starter] proves only to be good enough for only 150 innings over the remaining 34 games, that'll still be a cool thousand from the Arizona rotation. That's pretty rare. the last time any National League side did that was in 2005 when St. Louis and Houston led the way, with 1,048 and 1,029 innings by their starters respectively. I need hardly remind you it was those same two sides who met in the NL Championship Series this year.
There are a couple of reasons why such a strong correlation apparently exists. Most obviously, starters pitching deep means they're throwing well. However, it also reduces the load on the bullpen, when they aren't having to work so much. This means that when it comes to late-inning, high-leverage situations, your better arms are more likely to be available for use, rather than having to fill in from the back of the 'pen, for a potentially-crucial frame or two. That might be of particular significance for the 2009 Diamondbacks, where the drop-off in quality is significant between Qualls, Peña and [we hope he's in this group] Rauch, to the likes of Blackley and Gutierrez. Our #1-#4 have averaged 6.5 innings per start over the past four seasons, and that will definitely help relieve the relievers' load, as it were.
On the specifics of Garland, what we're basically getting is a right-handed version of Doug Davis (and with a functioning thyroid, to boot). He's a soft-tosser who pitches to contact rather than striking people out - a career K/9 of only 4.71/9 IP, and only 4.12 last season. Nick Piecoro reckons Garland is a sinkerballer, and he had a good groundball rate last season, at 1.79. If he can maintain that, it should play well at Chase, but the downside is, he'll be dependent on the infield defense behind him. As we all know, that has the potential to be a real weakness for the D-backs this year, with hardly an above-average fielder to be found between Chris Snyder and Chris Young, except on the days Augie Ojeda gets a start.
Ken Rosenthal says the cost is $6.25 million for 2009, with a mutual $10m option for 2010 [If we decline the option, he gets $2.5m. If he declines it, he gets $1m.] I note the price is above the amount previously thought to be available in the budget. This supports a couple of hypotheses: firstly, that the money no longer needed for the draft (declining Dunn's arb and the likely low return for Hudson and Cruz, all reducing the amount needed for signing bonuses), has indeed been diverted to this year's payroll. It also seems likely, given this offer to Garland, that $3m was not the last figure in the Johnson negotiations. The difference between Garland and Johnson is largely one of certainty vs. risk. The Big Unit could be a Big Bargain or a Big Bust; Garland, you pretty much know what you'll get..
The consensus of the ERA projections from Marcel, CHONE and Bill James is 4.53, with a range of 4.38 to 4.71. However, I've a feeling those are based on him pitching in the AL, so should be a tick or two lower in the National League. That may be partly countered by park effects, but the Angels stadium was on the hitter-friendly side - it has a multi-year batting factor of 103, compared to Chase's 107. Perhaps the most interesting thing is getting a year of Garland for, at most, $8.75m. He earned $12m in 2008 and, while it wasn't the best of seasons - the consensus at Halos Heaven was markedly against offering him a hearing - he'd still have got a much better paycheck accepting arbitration, than in Arizona. He's only a Type B free agent, so we don't have to lose a draft pick with this signing.
Not everyone is impressed though. Over at Fangraphs, Dave Cameron is utterly scathing, claiming the move means that Arizona management "have officially screwed up your entire offseason." Hardly. Let's just leave it at that, for I respect Cameron, a lot and am surprised he's sunk to the level of sports-talk radio hyperbole, buying into the Big Unit KoolAid based on Randy's decent last three months. Levski and - to his credit - Xeifrank, ride to our defense in the comments there. On the other hand, Rob Neyer says Garland is "a great bargain," and "exactly the sort of deal a team like the Diamondbacks should be doing." Emphasis in original.
We'll see how it pans out, but I must confess to being a good deal more optimistic about our season now, than I was this morning. Whether you're a #1 or #5, you still get about the same number of starts, and as noted previously, it's a lot cheaper and more cost-effective to improve the back-end of the rotation than the front. We can now move Petit to a long-relief spot starter role in the 'pen, which I'm probably happier with, than relying upon him in the rotation quite yet [don't forget, he's four months younger than Max Scherzer]. I think this is probably the end of the major moves for the team; with the exception of the back-end of the bullpen, the Opening Day roster seems largely set. Pitchers and catchers report in less than three weeks!
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156 comments
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Comments
Just wondering
but would you guys have rather had Garland or Johnson for 8M?
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 28, 2009 9:17 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Emotionally/sentimentally?
I don’t think there’s even a question.
But objectively, I think I’d rather have Garland at $6.25 mil than RJ for $8 mil. (His huge “discount” he offered the Dbacks, then turned around and “gave” to the Giants)
One thing does give me pause, though — RJ is still a strikeout pitcher, and Garland is not. K pitchers are much better suited to Chase Field.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 10:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just pointing out
Garland will get either 7.25M or 8.75M guaranteed depending on whether his option his exercised (and by who).
I don’t think there’s a right answer. Its a question of risk/reward. Do you want high risk and high reward (Johnson) or less risk but less reward (Garland)? I’d take Johnson but I can see the arguement either way.
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 28, 2009 10:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Not quite...
If it’s exercised, he doesn’t get any more – just a straight 10m for 2010.
It’s only if it’s NOT exercised, that he gets more for 2009, the amount then depending on who decides not to exercise it.
by Jim McLennan on Jan 28, 2009 10:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
You're right
but the money is still guaranteed.
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 28, 2009 10:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Enron accounting 101
If you go to Jack In The Box and buy those tasty tacos today for $.62 and agree to purchase more next week at $1.00 or pay $.25 if you decide not to buy more or pay $.10 if they decide not to sell you more then those tacos you are eating today are costing you more than $.62.
by foulpole on Jan 28, 2009 11:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
OTOH,
if those tacos (which ARE damned tasty, by the way) were being sold for $.90 just yesterday, and might ordinarily sell for that or more any usual week, then it’s still a net savings.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 11:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Too me, the bottom line on this deal is pretty much $8 mil per on a 1 or 2 year deal.
by foulpole on Jan 29, 2009 12:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Which actually isn't too bad at all,
considering Carlos Freaking Silva signed a deal for 4 years, $48 million last offseason.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 12:08 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There are still 3 years left on it so time will tell about the “value” of that deal but I did feel that MN was right about letting him go when they did.
by foulpole on Jan 29, 2009 12:11 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well,
for about $8 million, (that was his 2008 salary) they got an ERA+ of 65.
It certainly doesn’t get much worse than that. (Conveniently forgetting the Huge Manatee)
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 12:22 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think any deal looks too bad compared to that one
except for maybe Zito’s…. and Andruw’s and Schmidt’s. [sob]
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 29, 2009 1:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm not sure
signing RJ leads to a whole lot more reward than Garland, but it IS a lot riskier.
Garland’s not only switching to the weaker league offensively; he’s never even played in the NL. That should be a bit of an advantage as well. (At least through his first or second time through the league)
RJ at his best this year is almost certainly better than Garland’s likely performance, but remember — Randy’s also missed time due to injuries each of the past 3 seasons, and suddenly, he’s pitching in a much colder climate — bad back and everything.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 11:36 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
…and suddenly, he’s pitching in a much colder climate — bad back and everything.
That’s a non issue if he stays in PHX.
by foulpole on Jan 29, 2009 12:12 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That was my point.
I was comparing the deal we made for Garland with the deal the Giants made for RJ.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 12:19 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
My misunderstanding. I thought the discussion was RJ vs. JG in the PHX.
by foulpole on Jan 29, 2009 12:21 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Is it?
Are we comparing the Dbacks spending $8 mil or the Giants spending $8 mil, bablue? Because budgetary concerns make that a difference as well. (Besides the climate issue)
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 12:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just wondering
but would you guys have rather had Garland or Johnson for 8M?
by bablue on Jan 28, 2009 7:17 PM MST reply reply
by foulpole on Jan 29, 2009 12:33 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Could still be interpreted either way.
I took it to mean the contracts that were agreed upon, rather than the contracts that might have been. The Dbacks were never going to sign RJ for $8 million.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 12:37 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Its a question of risk/reward. Do you want high risk and high reward (Johnson) or less risk but less reward (Garland)? I’d take Johnson but I can see the arguement either way.
That’s the $8 mil question. It appears as though the FO wasn’t very interested in RJ after all. They ponied up for Garland but would not for RJ.
They must have felt that the risk reward with RJ was too risky. I’m not too disappointed with this move. Garland is a safer bet for the regular season and Garland did well in the post season for the ChiSox not too long ago. Max is somewhat questionable for the 162 game season and Petit, among others, are somewhat unproven.
by foulpole on Jan 28, 2009 11:54 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I would think
the franchise is unlikely not to pick up his option, unless he has a really really lousy year. This is such a bad offseason for FAs and SPs usually command a pretty high premium. (Which is why it’s a mutual option) The free agency market may very well be much improved next year, and Garland may very well decide he can make more than $10 million on the open market.
Depending on how he performs this year, however, it’s unlikely that the club would be able to pick up an equivalent FA starter for $10 million. It also insures certainty for Garland, since we have no idea how much of these trends will continue if/when the economy recovers. That teams are valuing draft picks now, perhaps higher than ever before, is the truth.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 11:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Or if you guys need more money freed up for arb players
but yeah, it’ll probably be exercised.
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 29, 2009 1:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Nothing objective about it
But objectively, I think I’d rather have Garland at $6.25 mil than RJ for $8 mil. (His huge "discount" he offered the Dbacks, then turned around and "gave" to the Giants)
1. We dont know exactly what Randy’s initial 1/2 price position was, but $8M is probably a bit high – more like 7 or 7.5
2. We dont know what Johnson’s final or potential discount was to AZ because negotiations broke down. There’s circumstantial evidence to suggest he would’ve considered less than $7.5M, but if your true market value is $12 and your starting position is 7 or 8, why the hell should you even negotiate with someone counteroffering three? It’s ridiculous.
Moorad indicated he couldnt get in touch with RJ’s agents, presumably to make a better offer, but this is the same guy who claimed $3M was “fair”, so consider the source. You offer $2.5m-3M to one of the greatest pitchers who ever lived, crying about communication breakdowns afterwards are crocodile tears – it’s your own doing.
3. SF did receive a hometown discount, but not as much as AZ. The Giants paid him $8M plus unspecified incentives. He probably could’ve made $12M back east, which is the real benchmark for calculating hometown discount, not what he was willing to cut from 2008. So, Johnson’s initial position with AZ was a straight 33% discount ($12M-4M=8M) off his market value – and if the Dbacks were more serious about signing him, likley closer to 50% (12M-6M=6M).
Thank you for letting me talk
by Diamondhacks on Jan 29, 2009 2:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Serious issues with this post.
1. Firstly, the number repeatedly used by RJ and his agents was “50% of his 2008 salary”. Which was much too high to begin with. But for the sake of discussion, call it $7.5 million.
2. “Circumstantial evidence”? What circumstantial evidence? And where do you get the idea that Randy Johnson’s ‘market value’ was somehow $12 million? That’s a completely arbitrary figure. You’re making a lot of statements here that are completely unsupported. Randy’s market price ended up being $8 million by definition, because that’s what he signed for on the open market. He offered the Dbacks a $500,000 discount? That’s, what? Enough to sign Jeff Cirillo to the veteran minimum? To go with a 45 year old starting pitcher in the twilight of his career and a recent injury past, whose primary motivation for returning for another season seems to be getting his 300th win?
3. Publicly claiming that $3 million is “fair” may have been a dumb statement, but it’s completely unprofessional and, frankly, stupid, to refuse to negotiate further with the organization just because of that. Randy’s agents figured out that they wouldn’t get the kind of money for RJ that they wanted, so they ended negotiations. Simple as that. And calling the $3 million offer “fair” is a subjective statement in and of itself — the quote was “we offered him what we thought was fair”. (Which may be very different to what Diamondhacks and RJ think is fair) The statement doesn’t do anything to discredit Moorad’s explanation that RJ’s agents quit negotiating — beyond what somebody with a preexisting vendetta against Moorad might come up with, anyway.
4. It doesn’t MATTER if Randy Johnson is “one of the greatest pitchers who ever lived”, you pay him based on what you think his future will look like. Past is irrelevant. If you’re going to argue that RJ is likely to outperform a $3 million contract this season, then make that argument — but on the open market, the expectation of 2009 performance is the only thing that should differentiate Randy Johnson from Glendon Rusch.
5. I already pointed out that the jump from $7.5 mil to $8 mil isn’t much, and incentives aren’t guaranteed — yet you seem ready to award them to Randy already. You REALLY think a 45 year old pitcher with a bad back who’s missed time due to injury each of the past 3 seasons is going to meet all of his incentive bonuses? Finally, there’s that completely arbitrary $12 million figure again. By most accounts, the Giants and A’s were the only teams to express serious interest in RJ — and when is the last time the A’s got into a bidding war with anyone? And claiming that RJ would have signed with the Dbacks for $6 million is speculation, plain and simple, based on…. absolutely nothing.
Personally, I wouldn’t be surprised if the incentives were largely included for the purpose of saving face publicly — but that, of course, would merely be idle speculation on my part.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 3:36 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is a good Garland thread
and the only reason I’m butting in on the Johnson thing is because your comment is so misleading. And now, instead of reasonably reassessing, you’re just digging yourself in deeper :-)
1. Firstly, the number repeatedly used by RJ and his agents was "50% of his 2008 salary". Which was much too high to begin with.
Too high for the Dbacks, obviously, and just as clearly not too high for the market. I guess that’s what you meant ;-)
2. And where do you get the idea that Randy Johnson’s ‘market value’ was somehow $12 million? That’s a completely arbitrary figure.
Pinpointing Randy’s market value is theoretical, but arbitrary’s the wrong word here. It implies baselessness. There are tons of respected valuations out there for RJ in excess of 10 million dollars, and I’m not going to track them down just because you werent paying attention. There were also highly sourced “rumors” of East Coast clubs, who Randy never really wanted to play for, offering 12 – reported by major outlets. It’s probably not in those clubs’ interests to publicize, or even compose, formal contract offers that are just going to get rejected, but that doesnt diminish RJ’s true market value (which is a conceptual number, not necessarily an inked offer). As recently as October 29, Fangraphs opined Randy was worth “easily $10-15M” on a one yr contract. Doesnt mean they’re right in the sense Randy will make good on that, or that the market hasnt declined in a month or two, but that’s the range of what experts in and around the game thought he was worth. Remember, it’s a one year contract. You dont think one of the big money clubs wouldnt salivate over one yr of RJ – and the probable 300th win – for $12M?
Randy’s market price ended up being $8 million by definition, because that’s what he signed for on the open market. He offered the Dbacks a $500,000 discount?
Again, you’re assuming he signed for his true market value, which are two different things. Also, you’ve omitted the SF incentives, which could amount to millions of dollars.
3. Randy’s agents figured out that they wouldn’t get the kind of money for RJ that they wanted, so they ended negotiations.
Yes, I believe that’s right.
…it’s completely unprofessional and, frankly, stupid, to refuse to negotiate further with the organization just because of that…Simple as that.
No. It’s not that simple at all. Let’s say you’re selling a used car for $12K. You put an ad in the paper, sort of weird stranger comes by and orally offers you 12 – but there’s something about it that’s unappealing, makes you uneasy. Maybe he wants to pay by personal check or food stamps or something. Later, your friendly neighbor notices your For Sale sign and inquires. You mention you might have a bite at 12K, but since they live down the street and your kids walk to school together, you’ll go down to 8 for her. She smiles and comes back with three. What the hell are you supposed to do, skins? Negotiate with her? It’s not your move – it’s HERS!!! She either makes a reasonable offer – or you smile, compliment her new petunias and walk away.
And calling the $3 million offer "fair" is a subjective statement in and of itself — the quote was "we offered him what we thought was fair". (Which may be very different to what Diamondhacks and RJ think is fair) The statement doesn’t do anything to discredit Moorad’s explanation that RJ’s agents quit negotiating — beyond what somebody with a preexisting vendetta against Moorad might come up with, anyway.
Enough with the melodrama. The notion that the Dbacks offer was non-competitive to a point of being embarrassing – relative to market, not relative to their internal budgeting – was the predominant opinion among baseball pundits – vendettas have nothing to do with it.
4. It doesn’t MATTER if Randy Johnson is "one of the greatest pitchers who ever lived, you pay him based on what you think his future will look like.
The fact he’s “one of the greatest pitchers who ever lived” is a prime projector of that future – along with other concerns you mentioned.
5. incentives aren’t guaranteed — yet you seem ready to award them to Randy already.
Hardly. I dont know if he’s gonna make them or not – but I know he pitched 184 IP in his first full year removed from back surgery. You’re the one trying to pretend the incentives dont matter – that’s what started this whole thing, your snarky blow by that Johnson didnt give the Diamondbacks any hometown discount, relative to SF or anyone else. I dont think you have any big political agenda here, but for some reason you’re doggedly misinformed on this issue.
And claiming that RJ would have signed with the Dbacks for $6 million is speculation, plain and simple, based on…. absolutely nothing.
It is speculation, and it might not be true, but it’s certainly not based on “absolutely nothing”. It’s based on clear evidence that location influenced Johnson’s asking price (and ultimately his signing intentions) a great deal more than straight market value did. Otherwise he’d be pitching for the Phillies, Red Sox or Mets. Right or wrong, the Dbacks (relative to other MLB teams) didnt really want him back – not as much as he wanted to come back (relative to most highly paid star athletes in his position). That’s a subjective conclusion drawn by me – and many, many others – from the numerical evidence – offers, counteroffers and widely accepted market ranges.
Now, let’s talk about JOHN GARLAND already!! :-)
Thank you for letting me talk
by Diamondhacks on Jan 29, 2009 2:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Or Judy!
Nice and quiet here , but there’s no place like home.
As you can see , we’re getting restless waiting for Manny to sign…somewhere.
This just in...Bobby Estallela can suck a dead donkey dick.
by victor frankenstein on Jan 30, 2009 3:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Randy Johnson
hands down
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Jan 29, 2009 5:47 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Jon Garland,
alright, nothing wrong with 4 right handers is there? After looking at these stats, I think Garland will be a solid guy to have, more so than Randy, even though it would have been cool to see him win number 300 with us. He pitches more innings than Randy and is much more likely to not break down. I read on the comment board on mlbtraderumors.com that Garland’s average velocity on his four pitches went up last year.
Know any pitchers that have been in the top two in the Cy Young award in the last three years? I do, Brandon Webb.
by damdrs1717 on Jan 28, 2009 9:24 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
After looking at these stats, I think Garland will be a solid guy to have, more so than Randy…
As Jim stated, he cherry picked those numbers. If you’re into stats you may want to check out K/9, BAA, WHIP, etc.
by foulpole on Jan 29, 2009 12:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He also picked a convenient cutoff point
because in 2005 Randy Johnson was really valuable and in 2004 he was worth 9.9 wins!!
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 29, 2009 2:07 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Counter argument:
in 2005, Garland had the best year of his career — 221 IP, ERA+ of 128.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 3:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
bablue's assertion
that Jim using only the 2006-2008 seasons was meant exclusively to put Randy in a bad light and Garland in a good light.
As you pointed out, what happened 4 years ago is most likely irrelevant.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 11:50 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Same with what happened three years ago though
The most relevant year, last year Johnson was worth twice as much as Garland, 3.8 wins to 1.9 wins. The only way you get Garland to look better than Johnson is to make the cutoff point 3 years. If yo ugo back 4 years, Johnson looks better. If you go back 2 years, Johnson looks better, at least with the stats Jim used. Thats my point.
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 29, 2009 3:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
A thought on Johnson's second half
Of those 13 starts, the majority came against teams under .500. In six games against winning teams [including one against the Dodgers], his ERA was a decent but not astonishing 3.43; in the seven against losing teams, it was 1.65. His year was powered by beating up on teams like the Giants – 26 innings, three earned runs over four starts last season. Obviously, he won’t get to face them in 2009.
"…you expect me to read all this?!" -- sergey606
by Jim McLennan on Jan 29, 2009 3:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well you can't fault him for doing better against bad teams.
Thats pretty typical. And a 3.43 ERA is hardly just decent, only 11 starters had a better ERA at all in the NL (including Haren and Webb just barely beating that mark, at 3.30 and 3.33), let alone just against winning teams. Thats a phenomenal second half. Yes, it was often against weak NL West offenses, but half the games were at Chase which is a tough park on pitchers. He may not get to face the Giants this year, but playing in SF instead of at Chase will more than make up for it.
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 29, 2009 7:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Still
Why the bleep are we looking only at the second half?
by paqs on Jan 30, 2009 4:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
If nothing else
Because he did make a mechanical change to his delivery that seemed to be rather effective?
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 30, 2009 10:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Don't know
Thats what Jim brought up. But he was really good last year even if you include the first half.
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 30, 2009 9:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Just for the record...
2005-2008, the main stats are:
Johnson: 107 starts, 671.1 IP, 106 ERA+
Garland: 128 starts, 837.1 IP, 107 ERA+
So adding an extra year on would actually have shown Garland in a better light.
"…you expect me to read all this?!" -- sergey606
by Jim McLennan on Jan 30, 2009 12:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Which was
my point to bablue.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 30, 2009 1:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
With a signing like this, the only stat
that I really cared about, after seeing that ERA+ was almost the same, was innings. Nobody wants Scherzer to get overused.
Know any pitchers that have been in the top two in the Cy Young award in the last three years? I do, Brandon Webb.
by damdrs1717 on Jan 29, 2009 12:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Feeling better now
Garland beats out any others in free agency, with the possible exception of Sheets, for whom Ive been secretly lighting candles in front of a picture in my closet. Seems as though the real key here, for now and the future, is Scherzer. Randy (and Sheets) would have been risks to Scherzers 170 inning limit.
Ive been feeling like Petit should actually be given the chance at the job (he with the 4.31 ERA and 1.05 WHIP in 08), but I had NO IDEA until this post that he was younger than Max. His age makes me feel better about not relying on him this year as a full time sp, but even more optimistic for his success in the future. I hope he is our #1 spot starter in 09.
by Counsellmember on Jan 28, 2009 9:48 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I certainly think Garland was probably the "best of the rest" of starting pitchers left over,
minus the injury risk guys, so given the circumstances, I like the signing.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 10:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Speaking of sports radio
I was driving today, and flipped through the radio to see if anyone was covering this. Here’s what I got on a scan of the three sports radio stations:
1. A long, in-depth discussion of the restaurants in Tampa that the reporters had visited the past few nights, along with a mention of the food they’d bought to stock up their suite kitchen at the hotel.
2. A pretty long monologue about how the Cardinals and their fans shouldn’t get cocky or feel like they deserve to be at the Super Bowl, or even feel like they deserve to be successful.
3. A discussion about the US Airways flight that crashed into the river in New York. This was Colin Cowherd, though, and that’s about what I expect from him anyway. When KTAR did get to their mid-show Sports Desk Update or whatever, they told me that the Cardinals were practicing in Tampa, elaborated on that for a while, and that mentioned the Suns and Coyotes were off today before going to commercial.
Thanks, guys, for that excellent review of the sports media today.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 28, 2009 10:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
DON'T LISTEN TO COLIN COWHERD!!
If we all stop listening, maybe he’ll go away?
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 10:45 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oh, we can hope
But I haven’t listened to him for months now, and he’s still on. I didn’t even realize how late he was on the air for KTAR. Ugh.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 28, 2009 11:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I have no idea
how the hell anyone can listen to that garbage for…. what? 4 hours straight? Something like that.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 11:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
For a laugh
try typing his name into the search engine at firejoemorgan.com. If you dont ike Cowherd, you’ll definately like what they have to say.
by Counsellmember on Jan 28, 2009 11:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I pretty much like
the vast majority of what the FJM guys say. [said]
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 1:05 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
That's hours of entertainment right there.
I did love FJM. Alas.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 29, 2009 1:22 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I like Cowherd for entertainment value (his job)
but don’t take him seriously. You’ll only react like this ^
Let's go Colts! Thanks Tony Dungy for the many years of success!
by AJforAZ on Jan 28, 2009 11:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He's like a car wreck.
It’s awful, but sometimes you can’t help but pay attention.
I’ll never forgive him for the lies and character assassination he vomited up after Sean Taylor’s murder. I swore that day that I would never listen to his shitty show again.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 11:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
He annoys me
I really feel like Colin Cowherd is a sports commentator who doesn’t necessarily enjoy sports.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 29, 2009 1:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm pretty sure he only likes college football
and not the actual game but the circus and prediction society around it. But for an hour or so I enjoy it. Usually listen at lunch for the drive down to McDonalds and back. (roughly 40 minutes)
Let's go Colts! Thanks Tony Dungy for the many years of success!
by AJforAZ on Jan 29, 2009 9:39 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
And
he, like seemingly all the EPSN duderinos, likes the gambling aspect. I swear, if I hear about the damn spread being covered as “analysis,” I’m going to freak out.
Russian Roulette is not the same without a gun, and baby when it's love if it's not rough it isn't fun.
by soco on Jan 29, 2009 8:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
......
………..
You live 40 minutes from the nearest McDonald’s…?
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 30, 2009 1:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well, he said back and forth
So twenty minutes.
But is it really worth a twenty minute drive to McDonalds?
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 30, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Kishi
did you fall of the bandwagon again? Haven’t we been through this before?
Russian Roulette is not the same without a gun, and baby when it's love if it's not rough it isn't fun.
by soco on Jan 28, 2009 11:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It was just once!
I had left my MP3 player at home in a hurry, and half the FM stations were playing Nickelback, so sports talk radio seemed like the lesser of two evils.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 29, 2009 12:54 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Hmmm....
new Nickelback, or old Nickelback?
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 12:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
New Nickelback
I’ve become desensitized to old Nickelback. At this point, it’s like white noise.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 29, 2009 1:02 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Awww.
I liked them back in the day. I’ve got their first two albums.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 1:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
New Nickelback
is indeed annoying, though.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 1:04 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I've got one of their albums
I do like some of the songs that haven’t been massively overplayed by the radio.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 29, 2009 1:16 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Sports Radio, Volume II
I turned on Gambo and Ash this afternoon to listen to them talk to Garland. One of them was going on about how, in the Diamondbacks rotation, Webb was obviously the ace, but after that, they were practically interchangeable. It worries me to think that fans are being “educated” by a guy who seems to think that Dan Haren and Doug Davis were of equal skill and value to the team last year.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 29, 2009 9:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Uhhhhhhhhhh
Garland….Haren…the sam
My head just sasploded.
Russian Roulette is not the same without a gun, and baby when it's love if it's not rough it isn't fun.
by soco on Jan 30, 2009 12:19 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The only way this gets any better
… is if at the 2009 All Star Break:
- AZ is leading the NL West
- SF is in the cellar
- Randy is repeating his 2008 2nd half domination
- Eric Byrnes agrees to go home to SF in a trade that brings RJ home for the playoff run
Try losing a playoff series if that AZ pitching staff is on track.
Ah, dreams!
by TAP on Jan 28, 2009 10:47 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Trade Eric Byrnes??
You clearly have the personality of a thumbtack.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 28, 2009 10:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It does bring up a point though
In the playoffs being good is much more important than being durable. It would be much better to have a healthy Johnson than Garland in the playoffs.
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 28, 2009 10:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
There's your risk/reward
Of course, your statement isn’t really arguable – but what are the odds of having a healthy RJ in the playoffs? Certainly, significantly lower than a healthy Garland.
by Jim McLennan on Jan 28, 2009 10:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
True as well
but I think I would take Johnson over Garland just because I’d hope to maximize my team’s ability in the playoffs all things being equal during the regular season.
by Brendan Scolari on Jan 28, 2009 10:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I did like the comment I read somewhere- “Well, I guess this means Garland will make the start when the Diamondbacks eliminate the Cubs from the playoffs this year.”
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 28, 2009 11:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Also to add
Davis’s ranking up there in innings/starts is pretty impressive, given that he missed time last season.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 28, 2009 11:07 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
I was thinking the same thing
"We...probed them all the way through. They're completely meat." — Terry Bisson
by Scrbl on Jan 28, 2009 11:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I like
Garland on the team, and didn’t have much sentimentality for Johnson sticking around for one more year. To the future, I say!
Russian Roulette is not the same without a gun, and baby when it's love if it's not rough it isn't fun.
by soco on Jan 28, 2009 11:51 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
It was a pleasure watching RJ play in a D-Backs uni and while I feel that Morad could have handled it much better than throwing out a low ball $3 mil offer and calling it “fair” in the media, I’m not torn up by RJ’s departure.
I’m not a big supporter of the spin factory known as the “new FO.” I don’t trust much of what I hear in their public comments.
by foulpole on Jan 29, 2009 12:32 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
So
Is everyone forgetting RJ was useless for large parts of last season?
Six straight losses in June/July which saw his ERA balloon to 5.5?
Everyone seems to think he’ll be good this year because he went out on a high. Is another year under his belt is supposed to make him better?
I’d rather have a sure thing. Garland had a bad year last year, but for 3 years before that, he had an ERA+ of around 115. He’ll only get better in the NL, and I don’t think there are many teams with a better no. 4 starter.
Plus, I’ll live a lot longer if I don’t have to watch Edgar Gonzalez throw.
by paqs on Jan 29, 2009 3:55 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Selective memories, gotta love it.
Is everyone forgetting RJ was useless for large parts of last season?
I think there were a few players that fall into that “useless” catagory. Let’s single them out too.
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Jan 29, 2009 8:57 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Selective memories indeed
Our ace Brandon Webb stunk a bit over his last 7 starts in 2008, posting an ERA of 5.70.
Dan Haren’s 7 game stretch of stench came from August 4 through September 5 as he posted an ERA of 6.17.
Useless pitchers? Some here might get rid of them but I sure wouldn’t.
by TAP on Jan 29, 2009 11:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Agree
This is the highest % shot at getting us into the post season.
1. Scherzer’s innings needed to be protected. Randy was a sure bet for overuse of the bullpen, Petit/EdGon, and/or Scherzer.
2. IF we DO make the playoffs, I’d rather have Randy over Garland…buuut, I’d rather have a fresh and effective Maz over either. Just because he starts as the 5th starter, doesnt mean he has to stay there.
I was originally down on letting Randy leave, but I’m thrilled to see that ownership was able to get some cash together to take advantage of the discounted prices right now.
by Counsellmember on Jan 29, 2009 8:56 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
I was originally down on letting Randy leave, but I’m thrilled to see that ownership was able to get some cash together to take advantage of the discounted prices right now.
Agreed, and how. Now if we could just talk them into scrounging up enough money for Adam Dunn…
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 11:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
The good thing about Garland is
he takes so long in between pitches, you have time to go to the bathroom, get another beer, and make a snack before he throws the next pitch. With him pitching to contact you better have really good infield defense or your team is going to lose that game. You all will find yourself yelling at him to just throw the damn ball, instead of loitering on the mound and staring at the batter.
Recipient of the 2008 "The Iron Man" award from scottnak of Halos Heaven!
by 44FAN on Jan 29, 2009 2:47 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Sure sounds
a lot like Double D.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 29, 2009 3:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yesssssssssss
I need to go to a back-to-back set with those two starting; I’ll bring a sleeping bag and just stay the five hours between them.
Russian Roulette is not the same without a gun, and baby when it's love if it's not rough it isn't fun.
by soco on Jan 29, 2009 8:01 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Chase Field
Slumber Partay!!
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 30, 2009 5:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Woooooooo
I’ll bring the air-popped popcorn and Diet Cokes!
Russian Roulette is not the same without a gun, and baby when it's love if it's not rough it isn't fun.
by soco on Jan 30, 2009 6:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Diet Cokes?
Weirdo.
I’ll bring the Pixy Stix and the ouija board.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 30, 2009 6:26 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'll bring
The hockey-mask and the sharp, pointy implements.
"…you expect me to read all this?!" -- sergey606
by Jim McLennan on Jan 30, 2009 6:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Why, whatever for, Jim?
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 30, 2009 10:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I
have to watch my figure if I wanted to get into my homecoming dress.
Russian Roulette is not the same without a gun, and baby when it's love if it's not rough it isn't fun.
by soco on Jan 30, 2009 10:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Whatev!
At least we’ll have time to talk about how we’re going to do our hair.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 30, 2009 11:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm thinking
I’m going to go with an updo, but curled you know? OH and plenty of sparklies and a tiara :-3
Russian Roulette is not the same without a gun, and baby when it's love if it's not rough it isn't fun.
by soco on Jan 31, 2009 10:52 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
OMG!!
YOUR GONNA LOOK SO CUTE!!
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 31, 2009 1:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I KNOW
:-3
I am Shiva the destroyer, your harbinger of doom this evening.
by soco on Jan 31, 2009 2:22 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Who's the new chick?
and what happened to the previous?
talking about profile picture, not personal life… just to be clear.
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Jan 31, 2009 2:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Ha
it’s Anne Hathaway from Rachel Getting Married. I guess I grew tired of Lady Gaga quicker than I thought I would, so Ms. Hathaway it is.
I am Shiva the destroyer, your harbinger of doom this evening.
by soco on Jan 31, 2009 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It isn't
loading for me…
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 31, 2009 6:49 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well
I don’t know what to tell you. Maybe your computer has an aversion to Ms. Hathaway and should be burned?
I am Shiva the destroyer, your harbinger of doom this evening.
by soco on Jan 31, 2009 11:43 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
It IS
a new Eee PC. Got it w/ an Amazon GC for Xmas.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 31, 2009 11:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm lazy
but what is an Eee PC? I keep seeing books come into work about it.
I am Shiva the destroyer, your harbinger of doom this evening.
by soco on Feb 1, 2009 12:09 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
ASUS invented the Netbook trend
circa 2007 with their original Eee PC 700. (I think the Eee is supposed to stand for “Easy to learn, easy to use, easy to play” or something like that.) My old steam-powered Dell Inspiron 5100 had its LCD controller fail when I was on the east coast a couple months back, so it’s basically been a compact desktop (using it with a monitor) since then. Got this Eee PC for $380 less $115 in Amazon gift credit to replace it as my laptop and serve transitionally as my primary computer until I buy a new desktop in a few months.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Feb 1, 2009 4:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
mrskishi has been looking at those
Our laptop has got some problems- mainly the screen is wonky- so we’ve been looking at replacing it. I want a regular laptop for going to school and such, but Morgan was thinking about one of the Eee PCs since she would mainly use it for browsing the internet and such. How do you like yours?
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Feb 1, 2009 5:39 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I really like it.
A lot of people don’t like the fact that the right “shift” key is the size of a normal key and to the right of the up arrow, and the touchpad keys may take some getting used to. I realized that I never really use the right shift, so it didn’t bother me.
I got the 1000 rather than the 900, because I thought the keyboard and display on the 900 are too small. This keyboard is quite a bit nicer. I don’t really like the fact that the max resolution is 1024×600, but that’s pretty much all the netbooks these days. I also threw down an extra $25 to get a 2GB RAM upgrade.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Feb 1, 2009 7:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Really
I bet Jim can’t wait for the season to start, so we get regular Gameday threads going again.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Jan 31, 2009 10:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
On
the other hand, maybe not considering how off topic we get. Only then it’s everyday.
I am Shiva the destroyer, your harbinger of doom this evening.
by soco on Jan 31, 2009 11:09 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I sorta thought
that’s what kishi meant….
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 31, 2009 11:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Opps, was meant to go under 44FAN’s post.
by Bcawz on Jan 29, 2009 5:48 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Arizona has always been a good club at evaluating pitching talent and attaching a worth the that talent.
Garland is an up and down type of pitcher, but you have to trust the Diamondbacks evaluation process. I think Diamondback fans will be pleased with this signing in the end.
Webmaster – If you are interested in exchanging links please visit the Fantasy Big Leagues website and click “Baseball Link Exchange”
by FantasyBigLeagues on Jan 29, 2009 9:02 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Russ Ortiz
would like to reply to your opening sentence, FBL.
Thank goodness the guy that “evaluated” Russ based solely on his “knowing how to win” is headed to SD.
by TAP on Jan 29, 2009 11:33 PM EST reply actions 0 recs
Beat me to the punch
in mentioning Russ Ortiz.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 30, 2009 1:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Jon Garland
Even as a Dodger fan, I have to admit that I agree with you that Garland is not a bad signing, in fact I think it is a pretty decent one. If you 3 year weight Garland’s WAR, you get a value of 3.0 (and that’s pitching exclusively in the AL) while Randy Johnson comes in at 3.02. Johnson is more likely to see a drop off due to age than Garland is. Garland is maligned because he is not a “sexy” pitcher. His 200+ IPs will help keep the riff raff out of the rotation, help keep the high leverage bullpen pitchers well rested, and pretty much assure you of four healthy pitchers come playoff time.
vr, Xeifrank
by Xeifrank on Jan 30, 2009 12:22 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
i just hope
that RJ will win 300 at Chase, don’t care that ’backs will take a loss, it will be spectacular
by sergey606 on Jan 30, 2009 2:57 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah,
I’d be down with that.
So long as he didn’t win any other games for the Giants for the rest of the year.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 30, 2009 1:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
uh HUH.
/glares , writes on notepad
This just in...Bobby Estalella can apply oral suction to a deceased pack animal's penile extremity.
by victor frankenstein on Jan 30, 2009 2:30 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Now
don’t you start now too!
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 30, 2009 5:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Over/under
On Johnson’s first 1-0 loss with the Giants? I’ll take May 12.
"…you expect me to read all this?!" -- sergey606
by Jim McLennan on Jan 30, 2009 6:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Take
the under.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Jan 31, 2009 1:17 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
As long as
It’s either Sept 21,22,23 and we’ve already clinched the division, then yeah, it would be cool to see him get it here.
Other than that scenario, no thanks.
by shoewizard on Jan 30, 2009 7:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd settle for him
Getting five wins before the middle of September. And with the Giants offense, that seems quite possible…
"…you expect me to read all this?!" -- sergey606
by Jim McLennan on Jan 30, 2009 8:16 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Bickley coughs up a fur ball....
he waxes eloquently about the cards and manages to mention the DBacks..
It will feel like the tension-filled minutes before the Diamondbacks came to bat against Mariano Rivera and the Yankees in the ninth inning of the 2001 World Series. And you know where the hero of that game is going to be?
“My aunt and uncle live right by Raymond James Stadium, and they normally use their front yard to park cars,” said Luis Gonzalez, a Cardinals season ticket holder. “I already bought the whole thing out. That’s where I’m having my tailgate party.”
Already, there is a remarkable difference between those Diamondbacks and these Cardinals. When Gonzalez’s bloop single brought Arizona its first major professional championship, the Diamondbacks became the most successful expansion franchise in history. They won three division titles in their first five years along with that World Series championship. Some fans became spoiled, bored – their perspective corrupted by an early reign of dominance.
Whole kitty litter box lining piece is here:
http://www.azcentral.com/sports/cardinals/articles/2009/01/31/20090131sb-bickleyunforgettable0201.html
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 12:02 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
What a dick.
Just because he fellates every other team doesn’t mean he has to be downright rude to the entire fanbase.
MEANIE.
(excuse the harsh language. he makes me angry.)
It would be poetic if it didn't suck so much (RIP Pushing Daisies...)
by emilylovesthedbacks on Feb 1, 2009 1:20 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
It did seem like he randomly decided to take a shot at the Diamondbacks fans.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Feb 1, 2009 3:26 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know what's worse
the ‘bitter beer face" or the face of a ’bitter cubs fan’.
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 3:33 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Feh
A fair portion of the local media seems to have this attitude as if the Diamondbacks fans are just bandwagon-riding suckers who were drawn in by on World Series win, but somehow the Cardinals fans are going to be long-term, hardcore fans for the rest of their lives, thanks to a Super Bowl appearance. Don’t they realize that the a large number of the people cheering the Cardinals now are the same ones who were cheering the Diamondbacks then? What’s changed, exactly, in the makeup of the city? A tortured existence for the Cardinals means nothing for longevity of bandwagon fans- yesterday’s tortured existence is tomorrow’s proof that one Super Bowl trip was a fluke.
Seriously, people, we’ll talk about how dedicated the Cardinals fanbase has become in two or three years.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Feb 1, 2009 3:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
We are 'spoiled'
we haven’t ‘suffered’ enough, so we are unworthy. That pretty much sums up the crap I’ve heard the past couple of weeks in the media.
Don’t get me wrong. I am very happy for the Cardinals. I am a fan of the Cards, I am just not as passionate about football as I am about baseball. I go to a couple of games a year and have so for a long time now. I am happiest for those fans that have been there forever. To all those that sizzled at Sun Devil stadium in September all those years, THIS is for you!
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 3:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Again, feh!
The Cardinals haven’t suffered yet either! It’s only been regular season losses! I’m a Broncos fan, and they haven’t experienced futility until you’ve suffered through repeated futility in the Super Bowl! =)
I’m happy for the fans, especially those who have been sticking by the team for years, and those who are going to enjoy the team more thanks to this success. But I’m just unconvinced that this means that the Cardinals are going to sell out all their home games for eternity now.
"Kurt Warner's career has died and been resurrected more times than Jean Grey, so it's pretty fitting that he ends up in Phoenix."
by kishi on Feb 1, 2009 3:46 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But I’m just unconvinced that this means that the Cardinals are going to sell out all their home games for eternity now.
This is Phoenix, one good bump in the road will empty the bandwagon real fast.
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 3:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Clearly,
you don’t know the ways of the NFL. There’s a reason this is the most popular sports league in the entire world.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Feb 1, 2009 4:55 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
This is still Phoenix
bandwagon city.
Fans of other teams will only go to watch their old teams play if/when the Cards hit that bump. They might have sold out all their games this season, but the stadium was not full. If this season hadn’t unfolded the way it did, I’d bet anything we’d see black outs next season or the year after.
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 5:03 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
But maybe
things have changed for the better regardless. A whole generation has grown up with this team as the only one in town now. We’ll see.
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 5:19 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
EPL?
I am Shiva the destroyer, your harbinger of doom this evening.
by soco on Feb 1, 2009 9:47 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
UEFA Euro Cup
draws more world wide viewers than our Super Bowl. Let’s not even mention the World Cup.
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 12:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Well
to be fair his original premise was league, but I’d think the Champion’s League would qualify. On the other hand, the NFL is the richest league, so I suppose that depends on whether you want to translate that into popularity.
I am Shiva the destroyer, your harbinger of doom this evening.
by soco on Feb 1, 2009 12:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
gotcha!
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 12:38 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah,
certainly it’s the most profitable, and contains the 2nd and 3rd most valuable sports franchises in the world. (Manchester U is #1, followed by the Washington Redskins and Dallas Cowboys, although the Cowboys will surpass the Redskins next year when their new stadium is built. I think the New England Patriots are currently #4, but my memory is hazy) I don’t think the EPL is more popular on the whole, and the World Cup is more like the Olympics or WBC. UEFA? Dunno, not sure how to count that.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Feb 1, 2009 4:59 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs
Oy! We need to sell baseball better to the world!
A friend on that European Forum posted this.. He’s cheering for the Steelers as their colors match the Romanian flag….
http://www.evz.ro/imagemanager/images/2009/februarie/01/pits.jpg
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 2:20 AM EST reply actions 0 recs
Jim would delete it if I expressed my true feelings,
but, F*** the Steelers.
That is all.
"Of course, it’s downright frightening to imagine how two Adam Dunns would turn the double play." - Joe Posnanski
by DbacksSkins on Feb 1, 2009 4:53 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs
I gave this person a link to
RotB and this site.
Would think we see a spike from Europe today if enough people check out that thread.
I couldn’t say that there or the mod would get pissed again. Didn’t like the pictures I posted a while back of the PAC 10 cheerleaders. Even the die hard soccer fans had to admit they liked that aspect of our version of football.
If you make every game a life-and-death thing, you're going to have problems. You'll be dead a lot.
by unnamedDBacksfan on Feb 1, 2009 5:23 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

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