going to argue that Arizona has a lot or is mainly composed of frontrunners, but some the examples aren’t very good evidence. First of all, the TV black-out rules in the NFL are ridiculous, and even some teams with long-standing fanbases have had trouble avoiding the black-out in the regular season and the playoffs. I’ve heard a lot of noise about Arizona’s trouble this postseason, but virtually none about the Vikings’ hardship to sellout. Of course, a large part of that is I live in Arizona, so the former is more relevant to me. The fact of the matter is that even well-supported teams can find themselves in a situation where they can’t sellout, especially in these economic times.

About suddenly seeing Cardinals shirts, I’d first counter that I’ve seen a ton of people wearing them the past few years and found that odd considering that the Cardinals have never been that popular. Discounting that anecdotal piece, though, part of is going to be two-fold. First, since you’re not an American football fan, you may have seen Cardinals shirts and not thought it distinctive. Now that they are winning and you hear about them constantly, the merchandise has more meaning so your brain picks it up and you remember it. It’s similar to how people think that there is a connection to them having a bad premonition and then something bad happening. That person generally gets many “false” bad premonitions, but only remembers the ones lucky enough to happen near an actual event. The other thing about sporting merchandise is that of course people are more likely to bust it out when a team is winning, and especially right after a big game. It’s not that these people never wear the shirts before (though many probably don’t), it’s just that a specific event has convinced multitudes of people to all wear their “favorite” team’s gear immediately afterwards as a way to celebrate and broadcast that they support the team.

Now the truth of the matter is that fans in Arizona are for the most part not Arizona fans, across nearly every sport line. There’s no reason even for someone of my age to support the Cardinals, even though we can’t remember or just barely remember a time when Phoenix didn’t have the team. Add to that years and years of terrible play, most people my age that grew in Arizona are going to follow another team, especially since there are so many teams in the region that have had success while we grew up: the Broncos, the Cowboys, the Raiders (well, depending on how old you are), the 49ers. So not only do the older non-native Arizonans follow other teams, but so do their children.

This season isn’t going to change things as much people might hope, though, unless it ends in either a Super Bowl, or is the start of a prolonging run to the playoffs every year. We’ve seen the Cardinals make it to the playoffs a year and never show up again; to keep some of these frontrunners the Cardinals will need to find even more success.

And for the record I’m a Bills fan, so really all I care about is that the Cardinals winning is good for the city. Other than that it’s just another lonely offseason for me.

Also, Jim, I know you wrote about a lot of other subject, but I’m about to leave for the airport and I’ll read the rest when I get home.

“The last time there was such a resurrection, a cross was involved.”

Whoa, whoa. Too soon, man. Too soon.

that should know better. Phoney allegiances are the worst.
I’m happiest for the long time fans that have been there from day one. All those games at Sun Devil Stadium in September where that bacon frying sound was from the fans on metal benches, this year is for you! Enjoy it to the MAX!!

Nice piece Jim.

I’ve seen a lot more Cardinal gear around town the last five years than I did the first 15 years the franchise was here. We have a generation now that has grown up with the Cards as the local team as it was mainly the young crowd I saw with the Cards gear. I’ve always thought this was a football town more so than a baseball one. And maybe the DBacks have turned the corner too though as I was at the last weekend series. Bigger crowds than I would have expected and the reaction during the whole game made it seem like we were still playing for something. We’ve still got a few years to go before that first generation is old enough (or ‘rich’ enough) to attend games on their own, but I can still see a solid fanbase developing for us. I think we’ll know we’re there when those Monday thru Thursday games start drawing more than 20,000 regularly.

The worst ‘visiting’ fans to sit by are the ones from their old city but have lived here for a number of years. They feel like to show they are still loyal to that old town team, they must be a complete asshole about the local team. Fans that actually come out from Chicago, NewYork, Boston, ectera are generally pretty cool to be around.

For the first time in modern history, Phoenix’s population could be shrinking.

It’s an idea that would have been unimaginable just a few years ago, when Phoenix was surging up the list of the nation’s most populous cities. Now, a variety of indicators suggest that fewer people are living here than a year ago.

No one knows for sure exactly how many people have moved in or out. But with the 2010 census about to get under way, some indicators suggest Phoenix’s population may be smaller than the projected 1,636,170 people.

Full story is on the front page of azcentral.com.
Are people returning to where they came from? I wonder if things stay as bad as it is now or get worse, just how this market will change?

Rickey Henderson and Jim Rice elected to HOF.

Big Mac receives only 21% — down from the 25% he received last year.

We (São Paulo FC) have the third largest fanbase in the country, only behind Corinthians and Flamengo, and despite being the winningest team over the last 20 years (list of titles to follow in the end) we still have trouble selling out games at home and are called “torcida modinha”, what can translate to “bandwagon fans”.
Last December we won the Campeonato Brasileiro for the 3rd time in a row, and 6th time overall (only team to do both feats), and still weren’t able to sellout until the last 5 home games.
That’s interesting when you compare it with our attendance for the home games of Libertadores da America, the most important Club championship (on wich we are on the top as well, with 3 titles) behind the UEFA Champions League. We’ve played the last 7 editions of it, and sellout almost every single game.
Still, we are not considered a “passionate” fanbase like Corinthians, Flamengo and others. And the media loves it. In 2007, when we got our 2nd Brasileiro in a row and Corinthians finished almost dead last and were sent to the 2nd divison of it, the media didn’t care about São Paulo winning one of the most important national championship of the world, they did care about the team who’s believed got the most diehard fanbase in the country and was sent to a secundary division (it’s a national shame over here…)
So the thing is, over the last 3 decades, the title that everybody wants to grab is the Libertadores, and after taking it to the house 3 times, our fanbase looks a little allienated, and even other teams fanbase care more about their team playing the libertadores than winning the Campeonato Brasileiro, the most important national championship.
We cannot compare it to the major league, since it’s the only thing the DBacks play, but the expectations look similar.

Notes:
- We are compared to the Yankees over here… Other fanbases cry about how we are the only team that can make big trades, or have the biggest TV contracts… and that’s not true. The truth is, we are the only team who takes its busines like a real pro-sports team, being compared to teams like Milan, Manchester, Barcelona, Real… and what a coincidence all those teams are always on the top of their leagues, uh? As for the TV contracts, it’s shared equally between the Clube dos 13, a “coallition” formed by the 13 biggest teams in the country…
- Our stadium was the biggest one owned by a club for a long time, with attendances around 120k ppl, for some games in the past… Now it’s down to around 70k seats, and that’s still a tough number to sellout, in a country that dont have a big percapita.
- There’s a growing sentiment of hatred (?) against our team over the other fanbases, all of a sudden teams like Corinthians and Palmeiras, that have a long history of rivalty between, just have “promoted” Sao Paulo as their biggest threat, and other clubs are doing the same, and that explains an interesting fact: over the last 3 years, almost every Sao Paulo game on the road was a sellout. We are the most important game the other teams play, lol.

As I said, here’s the list of what we won (the most important) over the last 20 years, and what the other teams did:

São Paulo FC: 3 Libertadores da America, 2 Recopa, 4 Campeonato Brasileiro, 3 Mundial Interclubes, 6 Paulista (State championship)
SC Corinthians: 3 Campeonato Brasileiro, 1 Copa do Brasil, 1 Mundial, 6 Paulista
SE Palmeiras: 2 Campeonato Brasileiro, 1 Libertadores, 4 Paulista
CR Flamengo: 1 Campeonato Brasileiro, 1 Copa do Brasil
CR Vasco da Gama: 1 Campeonato Brasileiro, 1 Libertadores
Santos: 2 Campeonato Brasileiro
Gremio: 1 Campeonato Brasileiro

I’ve seen more red shirts in the past week than, probably, in the eight years since I moved out here.

And more red shirts, I’d venture, than we saw around town in 2007 when the chromatically confused Dbacks reached their final four. It’s not just the branding, altho I think that’s part of it. This is also a football town, Card’s longer PHX tenure, Cards’ losing history, etc.

All of a sudden, everyone is a Cardinals fan;

Yes and no. I’m on yesterday’s bandwagon, but they’ve also enjoyed a resurgence since the new stadium, ratcheted up another notch with Whisenhunt.

The main reason for this astonishingly fickle nature is probably the one which has been well-discussed: many people in Arizona are born somewhere else and bring their loyalties with them when they move here.

No. As soco says, this “fickleness” you observe primarily stems from the Cards’ utterly dubious history, not the birth certificates of Arizonans you’re trying to conflate here into the root cause of sudden ticket sales. What’s perceived as astonishing, not only here but across the entire country, isn’t the fickleness of Arizona fans (and all that implies about being a difficult sports market to penetrate), but a comically archetype “loser” franchise improbably surpassing expectations. That’s the story – and it would be in virtually any American city with a team rewriting this kind of embarrassing history.

While they may feel some fondness for their new home town, it’s a casual attraction, one which is a result of geography and nothing more.

There’s some truth in this, moreso than a generation ago, before cable and online enabled migrating fans to cling to their out of market favorites – but I’d still argue that geographic ties are very strong, even in a place like Arizona. Lots of people come here to resurrect their lives, for a fresh start. I had East Coast allegiances, but immediately supported all four of the Valley’s pro teams. I realize not everyone is like that, but I’ve met alot of people who are eager to identify with teams hailing from the city where they’ve bought a home and where they’ve staked their future.

Ten years is just not sufficient time to build a fan-base: that kind of thing takes a generation or more

Really? Do the Carolina Panthers or Tennessee Titans ring a bell? New Orleans Hornets? The Colorado Rockies built (“tapped into” might be more accurate) a very nice fan base, drawing approx 40K into their eighth and ninth years of numbing futility, before attendance fell sharply.

Locally? The Suns almost tripled their fan base in their first decade, from barely 4K to 11K, and then almost doubled that with the new arena. The early raw numbers are certainly low by today’s standards, but Jerry built them into a very “popular” team – relative to contemporaries – in less than a decade – without the benefit of “buying a ring”. ASU football drew a dedicated fan base right away, with the original Sun Devil Stadium in 1958, and had to more than double capacity to accomodate interest and the Valley’s explosive growth. Kush had excellent teams, but they were drawing well before the undefeated ’75 season and didnt go to a Rose Bowl until ’87. You dont need to be a champion for Valley fans to show up – just field solid, competitive teams and dont overcharge too much for your product – something the Cardinals and Coyotes (and to a lesser extent the dbacks v.2) failed at.

The point is, there are plenty of examples, locally and beyond, of various franchises quickly establishing significant fan bases. PIR has long been one of NASCAR’s most well attended stops, and as soon as our PGA date moved to a bigger venue, it became the highest attended golf tournament in the free world. None of this took “a generation” – it took sports owners and marketers who created real fan utility (instead of mostly talking about it), and who let actual demand (instead of contrived business school projections) drive prices.

In 2008, our payroll put us between the Orioles and the Royals

…and our RPI (essentially W/L weighted by schedule strength) was lower than either of them, between the dying Cincinnati and Pittsburgh markets, if you must know.
 
Realistically, and with our resources, we probably should not be expecting to compete regularly.

Blech. May the ghost of Susan Sarandon visit your bedside! We…

probably should not be expecting to compete regularly

 in baseball’s worst division? Do you realize what a gift it is to not have to play sixty games a year against the Red Sox, Yankees and Rays? To not have to look up every year at the Angels? Or the Twins? Or the Cubs? Or the Mets? Or the Phillies? Or half a dozen other teams (CLE,CHW,STL, DET, FLA, HOU) that intermittently crank out championship caliber squads? Do you realize the historic nature of the gift bestowed upon the Rockies and us by Ned Coletti and the McCourts, Sabean’s reduction of the post Bonds G-Men to a shell of a lineup whose best hitter last year was Bengie Molina! Not to mention San Diego’s utter collapse. We will never see the likes of this 2005-2008 window ever again, my low expectations managing friend.
  
Ever!
 
The 2001 World Series win imprinted itself on fans, in a way that has proven difficult to shake off…

Shake it off? Like an irritant or an insult? Wow. There’s a latch on my front door that’s broken. It’s been broken since 10:50PM on November 4th, 2001, when I burst out the door too fast, to yell praise to the heavens, and dance. Unseen voices echoed our howls in the dark, across the neighborhood, like distant coyotes. Children saw joy reflected in fathers’ eyes and learned what it is to be a shallow American sports fan. Feuding neighbors exchanged high fives. Strangers hugged. Cats and dogs kissed. Men proposed marriage and women accepted. I’m not fixing that latch :-)

Painful though it is to admit it, the World Series was ‘bought’ for Arizona

It’s likely we wouldnt have a title without the spending, but the notion of “buying a title” is misleading, in that $ in no way guarantees a ring; there’s no strict exchange, as in buying a suit or a bar of soap. Jerry gambled on a ring and won, but what he actually bought, inefficiently and unsustainably, was something less tangible. For a new franchise, without an established farm to tap, he went out and bought potential playoff access. Competitiveness. Attitude. He bought a feeling, more than anything, that win or lose, we werent gonna be consistently pushed around by LA & SF bullies – who were quite a bit stronger than their 2005-2008 counterparts.

While I wouldn’t trade that season, 2001, for anything…

You keep saying that, but it rings hollow to me. It sounds to me like you would trade it, in retrospect. For something more financially prudent, sustainable, less sucessful on the field. Maybe an uninterrupted string of responsible, expansion-ish third and fourth place finishes in 1999-2004 – with a balanced, ever increasing budget. Think of all the fiscally prudent glory we’d be rolling in by NOW!!!! I dont wanna start the New Year by shoving words in your mouth, but it just seems this ubiquitous clause belies the tone of the preponderance of what you tend to argue. Maybe there’s a middle ground here we can agree on, and I respect the fact the title meant something to you, but I’m sorry, I just “hear” you wanting to undo it, wishing our history was different in such fundamental ways, without, imo, fully acknowledging that ultimate tradeoff.

I dont want to get in fight. Yours was a very good entry with a ton of stuff in it. I mostly wanted to flesh out a few thoughts and move on.

Cheers

In a Sep. 2007 poll on the ’Pit, 68% of the 155 respondents said they were under the age of 30. Now, that may well skew low, based on the Internet medium, etc. but anecdotal evidence also suggests that young people are more likely to be devoted fans of the Diamondbacks.

I’ve been thinking, Jim…. it might be interesting to conduct this poll again, this time well-separated from the playoff/division title bandwagon excitement of the 2007 season.

But, even with [the Rays’] stellar season, their average attendance in 2008 was 22,259, far less than the Diamondbacks (30,986).

Evidence in our own history suggests that a boost in attendance wouldn’t necessarily be expected for the Rays until this season.

Pathetic, once again.

Football fans shut out by the rapid-fire pace that tickets for Sunday’s Cardinals-Eagles game sold still have hope on the secondary market.

Thousands of tickets are available at online resale sites such as StubHub and RazorGator.

At StubHub, a record was set Monday, with more tickets sold for the Arizona-Philadelphia match-up than any other NFC Championship in the company’s history.

The 6,000 or so tickets sold on StubHub as of Monday afternoon apparently speak to tough economic times as fans weigh attending Sunday’s game against making a tidy profit.

The sales volume also might say something about the loyalty of Arizona ticket holders.

Few Green Bay Packers fans are ever willing to part with their tickets, StubHub spokesman Sean Pate said. As a result, StubHub’s average price to last year’s NFC Championship between Green Bay and the New York Giants was $710.

This year’s average resale price on StubHub is about $320, lower in part because so many tickets are available on the secondary market. In fact, the game is the lowest priced championship that Pate has seen in years and less than the AFC Championship between Pittsburgh and Baltimore, where ticket resales are averaging $380.

RazorGator reported prices for the Cards game ranging from $297 to $1,995.

Hundreds more tickets were available at places such as craigslist, where season ticket holders, who got first dibs on playoff tickets, were putting them on the block.

“The first one to contact me with cash gets the tickets,” said one craigslist poster from Surprise.

Some fans are critical of Arizona ticket-holders selling to the highest bidder. The franchise opted to only sell admission to Arizona residents, in part to build the home field advantage.

StubHub reported that ticket buyers have hailed from 42 states, with 56 percent from Arizona and 8 percent from Pennsylvania.

While Cards loyalists condemned reselling of tickets, others criticized the team’s decision to only sell tickets directly to those who could prove Arizona residency. The team intended to open it up this week nationally, but the tickets sold out before that could happen.

1. New TV
2. NAU is promising free breakfast burritos.

(When do the Diamondbacks start again?)

24? Totally disappointing. Not enough torture.