Kudos for Josh Byrnes
A thumbs-up on the Dunn trade from a national perspective. His presence in the lineup makes him a gamble worth taking, especially when the price wasn't that great. It's a short-term steal for the D-Backs. They should be thinking about keeping him long-term . Their lineup needs him. Put him in left field next year and trade Byrnes.
. http://www.examiner.com/x-559-Baseball-Examiner~y2008m8d24-Dunn-deal-a-great-one-for-Diamondbacks
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40 comments
Comments
You want to give us 100 million dollars?
Yeah, didn’t think so.
The best rotation lies in the desert.
by srdmad on Aug 24, 2008 7:08 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Indeed
he’ll be too expensive, especially while trying to extend Webb and keep Hudson.
What's for dinner, mum? Heinz Baked Beans.
by soco on Aug 24, 2008 9:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
to be honest
i dont think they will try to keep hudson. They already said they are interested in Mark Ellis who is currently the 2nd basemman for the athletics. Plus Hudson gotten injured the last 2 seasons with the same injury
by azwebber17 on Aug 24, 2008 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The second time
however, was with a freak accident.
What's for dinner, mum? Heinz Baked Beans.
by soco on Aug 24, 2008 9:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
I don’t think we’ll have Hudson back next year, unless the injuries drive down the price.
Now, if I remember right, Dan Uggla is a free agent after the season, and given the rending of veils over the fact that we lost him… =)
"Only one thing is gonna walk you through this, Mal. Belief."
by kishi on Aug 25, 2008 1:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Uggla's not a free agent next year.
He’ll be arb eligible though, so some have suggested that marlins would trade him due to cost.
Freedom is nothing but a chance to be better. -Albert Camus
by Zephon on Aug 25, 2008 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't bring facts into this!
Thanks for pointing that out, I thought I’d read he was a free agent.
"Only one thing is gonna walk you through this, Mal. Belief."
by kishi on Aug 25, 2008 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hudson
is going to cost too much to pay for an almost certain regression offensively and defensively going forward. Extend Webb? Absolutely. Hand him a blank check, turn around while he fills it out, and when he’s done, give him whatever he wants. But Hudson? No.
Manny Ramirez and the Dodgers: Filling the dubious shoes left open by Barry Bonds and the Giants.
by DbacksSkins on Aug 24, 2008 11:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This doesn't change
that the FO is probably going to make a run at him. What should happen and what will are not necessarily overlapping circles.
What's for dinner, mum? Heinz Baked Beans.
by soco on Aug 25, 2008 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The FO probably WILL make a run at him.
But as long as it’s Josh Byrnes calling the shots, rather than Jeff Moorad, we won’t overpay him. I wouldn’t mind resigning Hudson. I just don’t want to give him more than his probable value going forward.
Manny Ramirez and the Dodgers: Filling the dubious shoes left open by Barry Bonds and the Giants.
by DbacksSkins on Aug 25, 2008 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
"Put him in left field next year and trade Byrnes."
If only. If only.
by Azreous on Aug 24, 2008 8:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
+1
If we can get any team which says they are prepared to take on the F-sized albatross that is the Byrnes contract, I think team executives would find themselves looking around for Ashton Kutcher.
by Jim McLennan on Aug 24, 2008 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Definatly need to drop Byrnes
Byrnes hit his peak in 2007 the truth is he is not that great of a player he will never have that high of an average or hr’s again. we cant afford to pay this guys superstar money. But i dont think they will re sign Dunn next year either sorry ppl but his contract is just way too expensive. You should be happy with the out field we got Co-Jack is amazing Chris Young is great defensivly he just needs to work on that bat a bit he has potential to be amazing and Justin Upton who is only 20 and has already shown us flashes in brilliance our team is still very young give them time they will be great
by azwebber17 on Aug 24, 2008 9:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
this is what needs to be done
extend webb and co-jack. and get rid of byrnes and hudson to free up alot of cap space and make some off season moves
by azwebber17 on Aug 25, 2008 2:32 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Unfortunately
Unless we can find some team willing to take on Byrnes salary, we are on the hook for that and have to pay him, regardless of whether he is in LF, sitting on the bench, or filming further episodes of the show. See Russ Ortiz for details on this…
It’d certainly be nice to shift Byrnes and his salary: it [and the fact we stop paying Ortiz after this season] would free up enough salary to perhaps let us make a run at signing Dunn, as well as extending Webb and Jackson – which I agree should be taken care of. But we’ll still need a second-baseman, and have to address the issue of whether to re-sign Randy.
It’s gonna be an interesting off-season…
by Jim McLennan on Aug 25, 2008 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whoa-- whoa.......
okay, we’re all annoyed at the overpriced EByrnes contract, and some people don’t like the guy, either. (I do) But comparing Eric Byrnes to Russ Ortiz is NOT cool.
Manny Ramirez and the Dodgers: Filling the dubious shoes left open by Barry Bonds and the Giants.
by DbacksSkins on Aug 25, 2008 3:14 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There is
no such thing as cap space in baseball.
What's for dinner, mum? Heinz Baked Beans.
by soco on Aug 25, 2008 8:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I believe there is
Otherwise, they would just use “one-size-fits-all” hats.
"Only one thing is gonna walk you through this, Mal. Belief."
by kishi on Aug 25, 2008 10:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Badda bing!
Manny Ramirez and the Dodgers: Filling the dubious shoes left open by Barry Bonds and the Giants.
by DbacksSkins on Aug 25, 2008 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
you know what i mean
we are spending to much money on these guys and if we didnt have the burden of there large salarys we could make some moves in the off season
by azwebber17 on Aug 25, 2008 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
a better response would have been: “oh… you’re right… oops!”
"There are only two seasons: winter and baseball"
-- Bill Veeck
by njjohn on Aug 29, 2008 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wish
I cannot conceive of the DBacks being able to afford Dunn next season. I mean, they can’t afford Hudson, for crying out loud. While I really like having a real power hitter in the middle of the lineup, I just don’t see keeping Dunn could happen. And really, any extra money needs to be given to Brandon Webb ASAP. I still can’t believe this deal hasn’t been made yet. Please DBacks, just give Webb whatever he wants. I would be totally crushed if he ended up getting lured away by a huge wad of cash waved in his face from the Yankees, or something.
by SongBird on Aug 25, 2008 5:04 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
For one thing,
we still have a couple more years of Brandon Webb under contract. No need to panic about that yet.
For another, we absolutely COULD afford O-Dawg if we really wanted him. It’s just not worth ponying up the kinda money he’s going to make in the free agency market, especially for a guy whose defensive reputation has FAR outpaced his actual performance this season.
Manny Ramirez and the Dodgers: Filling the dubious shoes left open by Barry Bonds and the Giants.
by DbacksSkins on Aug 25, 2008 11:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
are you kidding
o dawg had an incredible year defensivly and offensivly up till the injury do you not follow this team haha he was hitting over .300 and always made great plays. But he wont be a D-back next year, like i said they dont want to pay his salary and they already have been looking at other possibilys like mark ellis.
by azwebber17 on Aug 25, 2008 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Defensively, not so
Here are his main fielding stats, Fielding Percentage, Range Factor, and Fielding Runs Above Average for the past four years:
2005: F% .991, RF 5.32, FRAA 36
2006: F%. 984. RF 5.23. FRAA 38
2007: F% .985, RF 4.71. FRAA 34
2008: F% .982, RF 4.61, FRAA 27
No matter what you may want top think, Hudson has been in decline defensively for a couple of years now, and since he’ll be 31 the next time he faces pitching, odds are he’s going to keep getting worse. Offensively, the drop-off is usually a couple of years later, but it’s going to happen too. I’d not be averse to a one-year contract, two at the most, but this is O-Dawg’s chance for a big, long payday and he’s going to get it from someone else: I’m happy to let another team pay over the odds for his declining years and spend our money somewhere more useful.
by Jim McLennan on Aug 25, 2008 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
GMTA?
Manny Ramirez and the Dodgers: Filling the dubious shoes left open by Barry Bonds and the Giants.
by DbacksSkins on Aug 25, 2008 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not to pile on........but.....
Fielding Bible concludes the same. His defense was not up to past standards this year
2008 -5, Rank 21st
2007 +20, Rank 3rd
2006 +13, Rank 5th
Fielding Bible Plus/Minus
A player’s more sophisticated fielding profile, as presented in John Dewan’s The Fielding Bible. It includes Plus/Minus, which represents the number of plays the player made, above/below the number that the average fielder would make, according to the video scouts at Baseball Info Solutions. We rate corner infielders for their handling of bunts, and middle infielders for their work on the double play. We rate outfielders for how often they threw out baserunners ("Kills") and how often they allowed them to take the extra base. "Rank" shows the player’s ranking in a particular category among qualifying players at his position (usually around 30). Pitchers and catchers are not included. We show data broken out separately by position, and listed yearly for the past three years.
by shoewizard on Aug 25, 2008 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
2nd base leader board
Second Base
2008
Rank Player +/-
1 Chase Utley +37
2 Mark Ellis +24
3 Brandon Phillips +18
4 Adam Kennedy +18
5 Placido Polanco +12
6 Dustin Pedroia +10
7 Freddy Sanchez +5
8 Dan Uggla +4
9 Asdrubal Cabrera +4
10 Rickie Weeks +1
by shoewizard on Aug 25, 2008 3:25 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really incredible Utley is on top of that board. What an unbelievable player. He basically forced himself to the top of that board by sheer will. There are plenty of guys on that board who should be better defensive players (Phillips, Kennedy, Pedroia, Sanchez, Weeks), and with his stick there is no need for him to put in the work… but he’s just an unbelievable baller. Eats, drinks, and sleeps the game.
"There are only two seasons: winter and baseball"
-- Bill Veeck
by njjohn on Aug 29, 2008 12:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
With all due respect --
do you have any objective proof that O-Dawg was having an “incredible year” defensively? Or are you just spitting out what the TV voices tell you? Firstly, Hudson made 9 errors this year — in 105 games. Two years ago, he made 13 in 157 games, and last year he made 10 in 137. Of course, errors are largely a subjective stat, but bear with me for a bit. In terms of fielding %, O-Dawg’s .984 in 2006 was above the league average for a 2B, which was .982. Last year, his .985 was slightly closer to the league average .984, but this year, his .982 is exactly the league average. Over the 2006, 2007 and 2008 seasons, using Baseball-Reference.com’s numbers, Hudson’s range factor by games played has dropped from 5.23 to 4.71 and then 4.61 this year. Over the same period, the league average for a 2B was 4.37, 4.23, and then 4.07 this year — so, in ‘06, Hudson outranged the average 2B by .86 points; last year, it was .48, and this year he’s outranged the average by a slightly better .54; granted, his range has also declined every year since he’s been a Dback.
In comparison, among qualifying MLB second basemen, a stunning eleven players have a better fielding % this year — Mark Ellis leads with .993. Heck, Dan Freaking Uggla’s .980 is the next best after Hudson, and we all know what a defensive wizard Dan Uggla is. O-Dawg is 12th out of 17 qualifying 2B. Using ESPN’s range factor #s, Hudson is again 12th of 17, with a 4.82, while Ian Kinsler leads with 5.77. The numbers REALLY get shocking when you look at his zone rating, however — O-Dawg comes in dead LAST, 17th of 17, having converted 79% of balls in play in his zone into outs. That’s behind Jeff Kent and Dan Uggla, among others. Mark Ellis again leads at 86.8%.
I love O-Dawg as much as the next Dback fan. But his defense has actually regressed since he’s joined Arizona, almost consistently across the board. Gold Gloves are won on reputation, more than anything else; as are contracts, and O-Dawg’s no longer playing up to his.
Manny Ramirez and the Dodgers: Filling the dubious shoes left open by Barry Bonds and the Giants.
by DbacksSkins on Aug 25, 2008 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Interesting to note that Kinsler leads the zone rating. Just goes to show you how much public perception (instead of reality) dominates thinking about defense. Kinsler is thought by many to be a total clod in the field. He might not have very good hands, but that kind of range is impressive.
"There are only two seasons: winter and baseball"
-- Bill Veeck
by njjohn on Aug 29, 2008 12:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't think it's a matter of not being able to afford Hudson
I think it comes down to the fact that Hudson’s asking price is not worth his value, considering he’s in the decline phase of his career.
Signing Dunn is a completely different scenario IMHO.
Freedom is nothing but a chance to be better. -Albert Camus
by Zephon on Aug 25, 2008 11:33 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Isn't Ellis older than Hudson?
If you think Hudson will keep getting worse because he is older, then why won’t Ellis do the same thing?
The best rotation lies in the desert.
by srdmad on Aug 25, 2008 10:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Hudson IS declining already.
Ellis isn’t. That’s the difference.
Manny Ramirez and the Dodgers: Filling the dubious shoes left open by Barry Bonds and the Giants.
by DbacksSkins on Aug 25, 2008 10:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't sign Ellis long term either
But if I could get him on a 2 year deal, yes, I would sign him. Not longer.
by shoewizard on Aug 26, 2008 1:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
History says Ellis will decline
I will take history over Ellis.
The best rotation lies in the desert.
by srdmad on Aug 25, 2008 10:56 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That is to say
You’re choosing projections over already demonstrated facts.
"Only one thing is gonna walk you through this, Mal. Belief."
by kishi on Aug 25, 2008 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think anyone here is saying Ellis is a marked improvement over Hudson… we’re just projecting salaries and surmising that he’ll be a better value.
"There are only two seasons: winter and baseball"
-- Bill Veeck
by njjohn on Aug 29, 2008 12:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't that the point of deciding if you should sign a guy?
Project what he is going to do.
The best rotation lies in the desert.
by srdmad on Aug 26, 2008 11:59 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

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