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Gold Glove

So, Hudson won another one. He's for sure one of my favorite players. But.... I really thought Brandon Phillips was gonna win this one. What do you guys think? I'm really excited he got it, but should he have? I'm also a little frustrated because Hudson just got more expensive. Why would they spend so much on Brynes??? They should have focused on HUDSON!!!!

http://mlb.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20071106&content_id=2293518&vkey=news_mlb&fext=. jsp&c_id=mlb

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Not only that...
...but they didn't select a single Rocky from the team with the highest fielding % of all time. (Home field scoring advantage be damned) Not even Helton??

To read a spirited debate on the subject, might I direct everyone here?

Of interest:

"Russell Martin

They stole 71% of the time off him and he had the MOST ERRORS of ANY NL Catchers...

What a Joke!

by whatapartier on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 04:52:53 PM EDT "

Hmmm... I didn't realize Martin was that bad, but then I checked the press release, and noticed that this was the only explanation of his selection:

"Behind the plate, Martin has become the class of the NL catching class. Not only is he a standout offensively, he is a workhorse defensively. He paced all NL catchers by appearing in 145 games and he saw action in 1254 innings."

So... the guy gets a Gold Glove for appearing in the most games and innings?? No defensive numbers to justify it besides that?

On Lee:

"Awful

D. Lee
FPct  .994
RZR   .724
OOZ     24

Helton
FPct  .999
RZR   .808
OOZ     42

Pujols
FPct  .995
RZR   .843
OOZ     51

Helton and Pujols also both have considerably more putouts and assists than Lee.  Helton had a grand total of 2(!) errors this season.  Lee had 7, though Albert had 8.  Adam LaRoche and Conor Jackson were also better than Lee in most defensive categories.  In fact, Lee runs neck in neck with Ryan Howard in most categories, who is considered by most to be a butcher in the field.  

I don't get it.  Martin isn't a great defensive catcher either, he's not even in the same league as Yadi in that respect.  And through for some reason people still think Wright is a premier defensive third baseman, his numbers really slipped this year, a number of NL third basemen performed much better defensively.

These awards are a joke.

"A great catch is like watching girls go by; the last one you see is always the prettiest." - Bob Gibson
by stl tyler on Tue Nov 06, 2007 at 05:03:57 PM EDT "

Now, keep in mind that this is a post from VEB, so you wouldn't expect it to be unbiased in regards to the Cubs, but numbers don't lie. I also liked that they brought up CoJack as an example of a first basemen that somewhat outperformed Lee who is NOT good at fielding.

Come on, Sandy Baby, loosen up. You're too tight.

by DbacksSkins on Nov 6, 2007 5:47 PM EST reply actions  

I agree with them
These awards are a joke.  No way Martin and Lee deserved the awards.  I'm not so sure about Ivan Rodriguez, Beltre, or Youkilis winning in the AL either.

Just like MVP, it's a popularity contest.

Bob Melvin Sucks

by nihil67 on Nov 6, 2007 9:41 PM EST up reply actions  

Goes by name recognition and reputation.
Although in all fairness, I think Youkilis did have a pretty good year defensively.
Come on, Sandy Baby, loosen up. You're too tight.

by DbacksSkins on Nov 6, 2007 10:15 PM EST up reply actions  

Have to say
Even as Tulowhineski makes his way up my list of most-hated players, I'd have had little or no complaint had he won the Gold Glove. I was, in fact, astonished he didn't, and basically presumed this was a gimme for the Rockies. What's more surprising is that these awards are voted for by managers, etc. rather than writers - I'd expect them to have more of a clue, but that is clearly not the case. Not if they think Martin was the best defensive catcher, preferred Rollins over Troy and Lee over...well, there's a broken chair in our back yard, which would probably be better at first.

by Jim McLennan on Nov 7, 2007 1:14 AM EST reply actions  

Tulowitzki
An argument can be made for him as well as Reyes and Vizquel.

Name RZR OOZ F%
Tulowitzki .861 87 .987
Reyes .871 58 .982
Vizquel .886 47 .986
Rollins .808 65 .985

I think I'd even bring Khalil Greene into the mix:
Green .848 59 .984

Bob Melvin Sucks

by nihil67 on Nov 7, 2007 9:11 AM EST up reply actions  

Of course
If we really want to go down the road of being intelligent and rational, Hudson should not have won for 2B.  I think you'd have to look at Utley or Phillips first.

Phillips' numbers were sick:

Phillips .863 49 .990
Utley .859 53 .985
Hudson .798 58 .985

Bob Melvin Sucks

by nihil67 on Nov 7, 2007 9:14 AM EST up reply actions  

Lets be honest
I should win the gold glove playing sofa this year ;)

Absolute joke, the only 'shock' was that they didnt give A-Raw or Jeter one..

by Wimb on Nov 7, 2007 9:03 AM EST reply actions  

My Gold Gloves
Here's who I would have given them to in the NL:

C: Chris Snyder
1B: Todd Helton
2B: Brandon Phillips
SS: Troy Tulowitzki
3B: Pedro Feliz
OF: Andruw Jones
OF: Austin Kearns
OF: Jeff Francoeur
OF: Eric Byrnes
P: Tim Hudson

Why pick Snyder?  Well... the gold glove is a fielding award, not a throwing out base-stealers award.  Snyder had a .999 F%, made only 1 error, started 9 double plays, and passed 9 balls.  He also threw out 35.8% of base-stealers.  He didn't lead one category or have the gaudy stats that Martin piled up by playing so many innings, but he appears to be the most solid to me.  Also considered Miguel Olivo and Carlos Ruiz.

and in the AL:

C: Joe Mauer
1B: Kevin Youkilis (Looking at it, the numbers back it up.)
2B: Placido Polanco
SS: Tony Pena
3B: Mike Lowell
OF: Curtis Granderson
OF: Ichiro Suzuki
OF: Coco Crisp
OF: Torii Hunter
P: Chien-Ming Wang

Bob Melvin Sucks

by nihil67 on Nov 7, 2007 10:03 AM EST reply actions  

Why
Byrnes and not Rowand?
2007 NLCS: the little scratch on the roof of your mouth that would heal if only you could stop tonguing it... but you cant.

by Adam1 on Nov 7, 2007 2:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Going strictly by stats
Rowand had a surprisingly low RZR rating of .861.  That's behind defensive superstars such as Soriano, Holliday, and Shawn Green.  Byrnes actually lead the NL in RZR.  

A stronger argument could be made for Beltran instead of either Francoeur or Byrnes.  I marked down Beltran for his lack of assists and double-plays started.  .988 F% is also kinda low for a gold-glove winner that doesn't excel in another area like Byrnes did with RZR (.923), Francoeur did with assists (19) and OOZ for RF (62), or Kearns did for OOZ for RF (68) and RZR for RF (.906).

I also don't like that all of the OFers get lumped together so I wanted one guy from each position.

Bob Melvin Sucks

by nihil67 on Nov 7, 2007 2:59 PM EST up reply actions  

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